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Introducing Graphene SDK...

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Comments

  • HopscotchHopscotch Posts: 2,782Member, PRO
    edited December 2014

    @FINNBOGG said:
    If Graphene is going to be what Im being told it will be. Then Graphene is exactly what I was hoping Gamesalad could become.

    Dito

    A drag-and-drop tool to quickly turn those creative ideas into a prototype, then being able to extend the good ideas into a final game, with no limitations. Sounds good to me!

  • Ed_PerkinEd_Perkin Midlands,UKPosts: 346Member
    edited December 2014

    will there be a trial and pro version like we have now and if not will it be free for existing pro users (until licence expires) even though it is a different product line:D ?

  • Thunder_ChildThunder_Child Posts: 2,343Member

    Im starting to think more and more about this Graphene SDK. At first I was excited...but with so little information available I am starting to assume the worst of a few things.

    The marketplace full of bad plugins.

    Very expensive plugins.

    The Marketplace full of bad templates.

    The template makers leaving everything up to the buyer to "just insert your code here" and not knowing it prior to buying them.

    Pro version only script or plugin usage only.

    An underground of script writers due to forum rules.

    More people locked out of forums because of a "pro" forums people cant access.

    Maybe most of this is just waiting for the worst to happen...

  • motorcycle boymotorcycle boy Posts: 429Member

    Ok I feel better now knowing that coding can be done visually with the option of purchasing plugins. However, I think I would like to start learning about lua as well as c+ in my spare time. However, I want to make sure I study at the right place. Is this a good place to learn C+ for gamesalad: http://www.lynda.com/C-training-tutorials/1249-0.html
    Are the other recommendations for learning c+ perhaps some FREE resources?
    Also I saw that someone put in a link for lua tutorials. I'll assume that's all I need for lua.

  • AppTacoAppTaco Posts: 125Member, PRO

    I'm really stoked about this new SDK. Especially the Lua scripting and native code capabilities. :) I imagine it will be significantly faster than GameSalad as well. Hope I make it into the closed beta.

  • mshannonmshannon Posts: 35Member

    This does not look promising at all. Completely different than gamesalad. Plenty of options for SDKs out there. Why would this be enticing? Disappointed about this. Been a gamesalad dev since Feb 2011, and this is alarming.

  • The_Gamesalad_GuruThe_Gamesalad_Guru Posts: 9,904Member

    @Thunder_Child said:
    Im starting to think more and more about this Graphene SDK. At first I was excited...but with so little information available I am starting to assume the worst of a few things.

    The marketplace full of bad plugins.

    Very expensive plugins.

    The Marketplace full of bad templates.

    The template makers leaving everything up to the buyer to "just insert your code here" and not knowing it prior to buying them.

    Pro version only script or plugin usage only.

    An underground of script writers due to forum rules.

    More people locked out of forums because of a "pro" forums people cant access.

    Maybe most of this is just waiting for the worst to happen...

    I would get in your bunker now and lock the door....lol.

  • safransafran Posts: 32Member

    At first I am really excited, but not anymore. What really worries me is the fact that most of the most important questions are left unanswered by codewizard.

    This is my third year using GS. I invested on a pro member subscription during the first year, to support the development while i'm learning, but as a windows user, I'm extremely disappointed on the progress of GS windows version. It is very annoying to see the mac version already reach 0.12 while the windows GS only 0.10.5. This means monetization for windows users can only been done using illegal ways (hackintosh or virtual box and the like). Unless, of course you are willing to risk using the RC.

    After the money and effort I've given to GS without the chance of capitalization, now I must be ready to (MAYBE) repeat the cycle again.

  • lycettebroslycettebros Posts: 1,598Member

    Graphene may well provide the opportunity to reset and restart the software development curve from a stronger stabler foundation that is scalable and extendable - something that GS has struggled to deliver.

  • Ed_PerkinEd_Perkin Midlands,UKPosts: 346Member

    I think code wizard or anyone from the GS team should do a video walk through of the software and maybe like a PowerPoint of the plans so everyone's clear?

  • The_Gamesalad_GuruThe_Gamesalad_Guru Posts: 9,904Member

    @Ed_Perkin said:
    I think code wizard or anyone from the GS team should do a video walk through of the software and maybe like a PowerPoint of the plans so everyone's clear?

    it's not ready for that as it's only an Alpha version you just have to be patient.

  • Braydon_SFXBraydon_SFX Posts: 9,090Member, Sous Chef, PRO, Bowlboy Sidekick GameSalad Employee

    @safran said:
    At first I am really excited, but not anymore. What really worries me is the fact that most of the most important questions are left unanswered by codewizard.

    Guys,

    You do realize it's the holiday season right? The GS team is techincally off of work until the first week of January, they already posted about that. I'm sure we'll get answers to questions after they return.

  • safransafran Posts: 32Member
    edited December 2014

    Please be aware that not all part of the world share the same holiday season. Please also check the dates of the comments. Most important questions were asked almost instantaneously, codewizard did reply to some of the technical aspects, maybe it is in his capacity to do so. In term of learning curve and other implications to subscribers maybe other staff can fill in but can't since its already holiday season. On the other hand, making such important announcement during holiday season will lead to this. Please also see the issue not only in the perspective of enthusiastic developer, but also from businessmen who see "investment going bad".

  • Ed_PerkinEd_Perkin Midlands,UKPosts: 346Member
  • FajlajpFajlajp Posts: 666Member
    edited December 2014

    @safran said:
    What really worries me is the fact that most of the most important questions are left unanswered by codewizard.

    We have to remember that it's christmas days now and that most of the staff probably have holiday themselves. I wouldn´t expect most of the questions to be answered until the next year in January when the whole staff is back.

  • jonmulcahyjonmulcahy Posts: 10,376Member, Sous Chef

    @safran said:
    Please be aware that not all part of the world share the same holiday season.

    You are right. But the GS company does. As such they are on vacation and are not monitoring the forums :)

    Graphne has tremendous potential. I think the whole plugin system is going to be like you would find with unity, So that would be a good indicator of pricing.

  • The_Gamesalad_GuruThe_Gamesalad_Guru Posts: 9,904Member

    Just remember what code wizard promised people was a peek or look at what was cooking with the cross platform creator by end of the year. GS is still in competition with other SDKs and you must respect that somethings they will keep secret right now. Would you have rather they not told you anything yet? As I said the software is still in Alpha and many details you are asking are not finalized yet so how can someone answer what isn't yet. They are still working on regular creator and this isn't taking away from that. I would estimate you have a year before you have to decide anything. This isn't happening next week or next month for that matter. You just need to be patient as I've said. Things are stil evolving and you just need to understand that only so much info is going to come out.

  • FINNBOGGFINNBOGG Posts: 1,809Member

    @Thunder_Child said:
    Im starting to think more and more about this Graphene SDK. At first I was excited...but with so little information available I am starting to assume the worst of a few things.

    The marketplace full of bad plugins.

    Very expensive plugins.

    The Marketplace full of bad templates.

    The template makers leaving everything up to the buyer to "just insert your code here" and not knowing it prior to buying them.

    Pro version only script or plugin usage only.

    An underground of script writers due to forum rules.

    More people locked out of forums because of a "pro" forums people cant access.

    Maybe most of this is just waiting for the worst to happen...

    I think a good way to combat those issues would be to have each item in the marketplace. Have its own review section.

    That way the user could quickly get a opinionated feel for the item before purchasing it. Each item has its own lil forum review.

    Only those who have purchased it can comment on it. But everyone can read the discussions of the previous buyers of said item.

  • willkeslingwillkesling Posts: 123Member, PRO

    This looks awesome, can't wait to take it for a test drive. :)

  • safransafran Posts: 32Member

    Well this is getting kinda weird. Please review @Chunkypixels and @Chakku 's comments in page one, and similar comments in other pages.

    @Chunkypixels said:
    Hmmmm... Ok... So I might as well be the one to break the euphoria...

    So if GameSalad already struggles to maintain and update just one engine in a timely fashion, hows it going to be when they have 2 to support?

    Their questions were left unanswered. For me, whose currently struggling with year end target and 2015 proposals, I only have the next TWO DAYS to decide whether our company should continue investing money and human resources in GS SDK or switch to another SDK instead.

    Graphene is not the problem, I am willing to wait. But what about assurance on quality updates, equal/compatibility, and other things in GS's roadmap promised before? This uncertainty was what kept us from continuing our pro subscription in the second year. Announcement during GS (US) holiday season is very disturbing for me, because it's adding to the uncertainty. GS staffs can have their holidays, but they left me in a difficult position during my hectic two days in 2014. Announcements are made to be followed up, not to rise uncertainty.

  • The_Gamesalad_GuruThe_Gamesalad_Guru Posts: 9,904Member
    edited December 2014

    Well @Chunkypixels‌ I would say I'm stupid. I shall leave it to you guys to sort out the rest then.

  • smallingsmalling Posts: 72Member, PRO
    edited December 2014

    If there are only two choices, then I must be stupid - arrogance is not one of my attributes. I don't know if I can learn a programming language, but I'm looking forward to trying.

  • Thunder_ChildThunder_Child Posts: 2,343Member
    edited December 2014

    @The_Gamesalad_Guru said:
    I would get in your bunker now and lock the door....lol.

    Yea when you say that...I feel I must be on target. Obviously my comments were based on experience here with this creator and forums so I shoukdnt be expecting anything different. Some changes would be nice but would never be a deal breaker with me.

    Are you planning on making not templates...but any plugins or providing services?

    Is there anyone in this community with experience that possibly plans on providing services for the newbies?

  • GnarlyGnarly canadaPosts: 840Member

    @smalling said:
    If there are only two choices, then I must be stupid - arrogance is not one of my attributes. I don't know if I can learn a programming language, but I'm looking forward to trying.

    Stupid you need. Stupid I got. Attributes and code. It easily copies and pastes into everything I do.

  • The_Gamesalad_GuruThe_Gamesalad_Guru Posts: 9,904Member
    edited December 2014

    @Thunder_Child said:
    I must be on target

    I said it as a joke because you sound paranoid, like a doomsday preper....lol

    Of course I will continue to do what I do, which is make tutorials, including Graphene, and supporting the community with the knowledge I may possess about The software old and new.

  • tatiangtatiang Posts: 11,639Member, Sous Chef, PRO, Senior Sous-Chef

    I think it's wise to question the process and be doubtful about an unseen product. I love using GameSalad because it's easy (everything is relative, for sure, but compared to other tools?) and it does what I need. I don't have games waiting in the wings that require joints or advanced coding but... I'm excited to be able to add some of those things in the future once Graphene is released.

    I think critical comments are fine as are opposing viewpoints as long as things stay respectful.

    New to GameSalad? (FAQs)   |   Tutorials   |   Templates   |   Greenleaf Games   |   Educator & Certified GameSalad User

  • lycettebroslycettebros Posts: 1,598Member

    I agree but it is way too early to man any barricades.

  • colandercolander Posts: 1,610Member

    Wow what a read. There are a lot of jaded users here and who can blame them. I have been here for about 16 months and have experienced a lot of what they are complaining about. For example I have an app I developed sitting on the shelf waiting for a behaviour to import images from a server. I made the silly mistake of thinking it would happen soon for avatars as part of the multiplayer system. I now realise this may happen or it may never happen. They have other things with higher priority plus the continuing changes from the app stores to deal with. So I wait.

    The thing I like about Graphene is I can still drag and drop to make my apps but when I hit a road block I can hopefully buy a plugin from the store to move on. Or I can learn how to write one myself, in either case I don't have to wait for GS to get around to it if they ever do. I could even pay someone to write a plugin for a feature I need and maybe even sell it on the store.

    I could jump ship now and go to Unity which would be the next logical step from my perspective. A quick look at their pricing and it looks like $4,500 to publish to everything and I would assume some sort of ongoing update cost. I can afford this but I don't have the luxury of time to learn it and it would also take longer to create apps.

    If I ever write the next hit and make a fortune I would then have the the time and be gone to Unity in a heartbeat. I would love to delve into that level of programming but in the absence of that unlikely event I will stay with GS.

    I accept that things are always changing and in computers it changes at a fast pace. The current version of Creator is not keeping up. All companies are limited by their resources and can only do so much. With software, creativity and progress can be greatly increased beyond this by allowing the users (And who better they know what they need) to program the features they want through plugins and share or sell them to other users.

    I would think at some point in the future the current software will be replaced by a basic version of Graphene. That would seem logical why waste resources on two versions. This doesn't concern me if GS doesn't provide the ability to import my current apps someone will using a plugin.

    From my perspective first and foremost they must stay in business or everything I have done to date will be wasted. If they'd stayed on the old course I would say that it would be a worring possibility they would cease trading at some point in the future. It doesn't seem like the current software could ever keep up. Five or six years in beta and no sign of it getting out says a lot about that.

    All things considered I think it is a very good development.

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