Weird Copyright infringement mail, Not From Apple!

MagoNicolasMagoNicolas Member, PRO Posts: 2,090
edited November -1 in Working with GS (Mac)
I Received this today, They Say that Only THEM can have Dash on the name of their apps..

What to do?

Cheers!

June 17, 2011
SENT VIA ELECTRONIC MAIL
ePig Games
contact@epiggames.com
RE: Infringement of PlayFirst, Inc. (“PlayFirst”) Intellectual Property
Dear Sir or Madam,
I write to notify you that ePig Games’ game “ePig Dash” has infringed PlayFirst’s intellectual properties.
Specifically, the name “ePig Dash” is substantially similar to PlayFirst’s trademarks. Please act expeditiously to
remove any such references to PlayFirst’s intellectual properties and rename your game at the Apple, Inc. App Store
within five (5) days of receipt of this letter and confirm your removal in writing. Note that failure to change the
name as requested may exacerbate the damages associated with your infringement.
As relates to the case at hand, PlayFirst owns the following registered trademarks: DASH (U.S. Reg. No.
3,719,384), DASH (U.S. Reg. No. 3,719,385), DINER DASH (U.S. Reg. 3,127,997), WEDDING DASH (U.S. Reg.
No. 3,386,893), FITNESS DASH (U.S. Reg. No. 3,555,176), PARKING DASH (U.S. Reg. No. 3,555,175),
COOKING DASH (U.S. Reg. No. 3,555,174), DINER DASH FLO ON THE GO (U.S. Reg. No. 3,520,560),
FASHION DASH (U.S. Reg. No. 3,555,167), DIAPER DASH (U.S. Reg. No. 3,617,222), DAIRY DASH (U.S.
Reg. No. 3,513,966), DOGGIE DASH (U.S. Reg. No. 3,541,440), and DINER DASH SIZZLE & SERVE (U.S.
Reg. No. 3,528,090). ). In addition, DINER DASH is a registered trademark in Canada (TMA677,886), the E.U.
(CTM Reg. No. 4483541), Japan (Reg. No. 5002947), and Korea (Reg. No. 40-0728617).
PlayFirst has also built the “Dash” franchise into one of the Apple App Store’s most successful application
franchises with four Top 100 Games: Diner Dash®, Cooking Dash®, Wedding Dash®, and Hotel Dash® which
together have totaled over 200 million play sessions to-date in 2010. In addition, Diner Dash now boasts more than
half-a-billion downloads across all gaming platforms. As such, PlayFirst has built a very strong and world
renowned brand around DASH, which covers video games and iPhone Apps across a wide variety of genres,
including, without limitation to, those associated with your game.
ePig Games’ use of the trademark “ePig Dash” infringes on PlayFirst’s well-known DASH trademark and its other
marks containing the term “Dash” because it is substantially similar to PlayFirst’s trademarks listed above
(specifically DAIRY DASH, DOGGIE DASH, and DINER DASH) and is highly likely to create customer
confusion as to PlayFirst’s sponsorship or affiliation with such products associated with the infringing trademark
“ePig Dash”. Accordingly, PlayFirst requests that you rename the game “ePig Dash” at the Apple, Inc. AppStore
within five (5) days from your receipt of this letter.
Though we are confident that we would be able to resolve this matter amicably, we hereby reserve all rights and
remedies. Please feel free to contact me directly at either (415) 848-5800 or hung@playfirst.com if you have any
questions
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Comments

  • JamieOneilJamieOneil Member Posts: 877
    Did apple even look into this?

    That email is pretty much saying anyone who has 'dash' in there app name= COPYRIGHT!

    JamieOneil
  • MagoNicolasMagoNicolas Member, PRO Posts: 2,090
    JamieOneil said:
    Did apple even look into this?

    That email is pretty much saying anyone who has 'dash' in there app name= COPYRIGHT!

    JamieOneil

    There was no mail from apple.. is like when they wanted to remove or change or names of apps that have doodle...
  • old_kipperold_kipper Member Posts: 1,420
    If you have access to a copyright lawyer I would ask their opinion. I have no real legal knowledge but would think that they would protect their name, but it may not be something they can enforce if the word dash was used before they did, and even if not then ownership of a word ... Ask someone with real knowledge. Opinion is worth very little in this situation.
  • LuckyLurcherLuckyLurcher Member Posts: 343
    The word 'Dash' has been used in video games since as least 1984 when Boulder Dash was released by First Star. The most recent version is 2011. I think they did an iPhone version too. You could point this out to them and see if they are willing to take on First Star too. Or let it them take you to court... any publicity is good publicity!
  • SlickZeroSlickZero Houston, TexasMember, Sous Chef Posts: 2,870
    I'd get a lawyer to look at it. I don't think you can copyright a verb. They have copyrights for the names Diner Dash, and all those others, because those are combined words, but I don't believe they hold a copyright to the word "Dash". It would be like me saying I have a copyright to the word jump. Or Mortal Combat suing over the game Modern Combat, because they used the word Combat. Like I said, I'm pretty sure you can't copyright a verb, all you can do is build a brand around it.

    I'd definitely get a Lawyer to look at it. Don't just let them bully you, because they will if you let them.
  • kapserkapser Member Posts: 458
    I heard of that a while ago.. Funnily enough, I heard Farmville wanted to do the same with Ville.

    Honestly... these guys are pricks. How dare they copyright such a word? I like the word dash! I'm not even sure Tetris is copywritted and it's not such a common word.

    I suggest you change the name, but these guys are actually asking you a decent amount of work for a pretty dumb reason.

    I wish the creators of the classic Boulder Dash, made in 1984, forced them to change the name of all their games see how it feels.
  • MrshoestoreMrshoestore Member Posts: 181
    like old_kipper said... If you want to keep the name, you are going to have to talk to a good copyright lawyer. It is very dependent on the actual terms that "DASH" is copyrighted by them. I believe they have to has specific copyright claim on it, and this may be a scare tactic to reserve their copyrights without any legal obligations. But I have no experience with this. Yea, definitely a lawyer question.
  • old_kipperold_kipper Member Posts: 1,420
    Mad dash by itos was 1994. Get legal opinion.
  • SlickZeroSlickZero Houston, TexasMember, Sous Chef Posts: 2,870
    Actually, I'd ask them to provide documentation that shows they own the copyright to the word "Dash" and that you will gladly change the name once that is provided.
  • LuckyLurcherLuckyLurcher Member Posts: 343
    I just searched the word 'dash' on the app store- 447 apps!
  • kapserkapser Member Posts: 458
    Im pretty sure it's not a scare tactic. It's a big franchise and I heard they planned into getting this copyright. But it's funny that it's just a lonely word and other dash games were done 20 years ago. There's about 20 dash games not owned by them and made before, but they will probably only target those on the app store/facebook.

    It feels like making Super Dinner and Super Ninja and then asking Nintendo to change the name of their next Super Mario Bros...
  • SparkyidrSparkyidr Member Posts: 2,033
    It's very much what the guys tried with "Doodle" a few months ago. Some people will be scred off easily enough and go and change their titles.

    "Dash" is a verb in the English language. I very much doubt that they have any sort of copyright on it. But you should ask for documentation to be sent to you, stating that they do. Email them back asking for that, and tell them your legal team will look over it, and you will get back to them.

    Also, as other people have pointed out, they are not the first to have "something Dash" as a videogame title. They may well have "..built up a brand...blah blah blah"...but they can't possibly hold claim to that naming structure.

    Their whole argument is that customers mistake your game for one of theirs.
    this is EXACTLY the tactic employed by the doodle jump guys when they sent out a very similar letter a few months ago.
  • micksolomicksolo Member Posts: 264
    I thought these kinds of things had to be done through Apple? The easiest thing is to just change the name to Epig Run or some other synonym of dash.

    If you want to take them on I suggest looking into the case where Timoth Langdell had registered the word "Edge" for games and was suing anyone using it. From my memory it was thrown out, but I don't know if you have the time or money to go through expensive lawsuit.

    You are based in Chile yeah? Legally for the, can they sue you there?
  • HoneyTribeStudiosHoneyTribeStudios Member Posts: 1,792
    Send their letter to websites and use it for free promo!

    Tell the tech sites you're an indie getting bullied by a big company with unreasonable demands. Because of Lodsys copyright infringement has been in the media a lot lately. So you could get some press out of it?
  • calvin9403calvin9403 Member Posts: 3,186
    I think it is kinda weird why people say "dash" is copyright

    if that is the case than most of the games will go into legel issue

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  • quantumsheepquantumsheep Member Posts: 8,188
    Something about this stinks...

    Can you post the email address of the person that sent this to you please?

    The reason I ask is that this issue was brought up a long time ago (e.g. 'Dash'), and yet there are still plenty of games on the app store with 'Dash' in their title.

    Also, I don't believe the lawyer that 'wrote' to you has worked at playfirst since October 2010. Though I could be wrong.

    Let us know.

    QS

    Dr. Sam Beckett never returned home...
    Twitter: https://twitter.com/Quantum_Sheep
    Web: https://quantumsheep.itch.io

  • SnowAppleMintSnowAppleMint Member Posts: 23
    "use of the trademark “ePig Dash” infringes on PlayFirst’s well-known DASH trademark"
    I would almost certainly seek the opinion of an attorney. In this area of copyrights, patents and trademarks people are really sensitive and get mad when something 'similar' pops up.
  • UtopianGamesUtopianGames Member Posts: 5,692
    I would throw it in the bin....like someone said above Boulder Dash was made before these games.

    In fact i might make a quickie and call it Dash Dash Dash:)

    Darren.
  • dingosmoovdingosmoov Member Posts: 130
    I would suggest getting a lawyer. Or change the name. Also just to clarify the infringement is about TRADEMARK not COPYRIGHT, they are different things.

    The process by which you obtain a trademark is different and allows time for people to challenge if it should be registered or not. If it is not challenged then they can register it even the word "DASH". But if challenged in court they could lose that registration.

    Also one of the biggest mistakes to think is just because someone else uses their "DASH" in their name means that you can too. Those others could very well be paying a license to use their name.

    Also the strength in their trademark seems to be the use of "DASH" with other words not "DASH" alone. That may actually give them power in court. The combination could cause confusion to their products.

    Finally trademark law states that you must make every effort to protect your trademark or you can actually lose it. So if you become aware of someone infringing on your registered trademark and you do not document that you tried to protect it, you could lose that trademark. That's one of the main reasons to send this letter.

    On the positive side. Like someone mentioned above. You could send this letter to every blog, news channel, tv station you can find. BUT BE VERY CAREFUL...

    Lets say you get tons of promotion, and sell 1,000's of games. If your game is still named with the "Dash" and they do win in court. What would happen is that all the revenue of games sold with that name could be used as damages you would have to pay to them.

    I would change the name, but use the letter to inform people why. That way can get publicity from the letter, while making money you can keep. Changing the name and using the letter to explain why could be one of the best publicity for your game ever.
  • SparkyidrSparkyidr Member Posts: 2,033
    Basically. the crux or their request is that your product could be mistaken for one of theirs.

    You should be able to do so quite easily imo.

    Very different styles, both graphically and gameplay wise.
    Also, you are using it in conjunction with your already established character...which should avoid any confusion that it belongs to anyone but you guys.

    If I were in your situation (and I was with the whole doodle thing a while ago), I would stand your ground if you feel like they are being unreasonable.

    Also, bear in mind that this has come direct from you, and not via apple.
  • MagoNicolasMagoNicolas Member, PRO Posts: 2,090
    HEre is the Mail: hung@playfirst.com

    Thanks For Comments, i DONT want to change the name, will ask a lawyer.

    Sparky, Can You send me the emails you answered to Apple or to Doodle?

    Thanks!
  • WeswogWeswog Member Posts: 1,171
    Wait so would this mean Monster Dash would get contacted too and Playfirst would definitely lose in that argument with them.

    Cheers, Weswog
  • MagoNicolasMagoNicolas Member, PRO Posts: 2,090
    Weswog said:
    Wait so would this mean Monster Dash would get contacted too and Playfirst would definitely lose in that argument with them.

    Cheers, Weswog

    In theory... they will contact them.
  • mangaroomangaroo Member Posts: 419
    I would contact apple ONLY at this point just to let them know what you received (with a short summary above of course) and ask their advice. They are basically harassing you, presumably other apple devs with trivial lawsuits and Apple will want to sort it out from the root. Dash has been used in games since kids played video games of any type they can't claim it for their own, they own copyrights for various games with dash, you own copyright for one as do many others and they want to stomp them all out? gtfo

    if they wanted a trademark name they should copyright it. oh thats right u cant copyright "dash" because its a proper word, not an original idea.. they can copyright arrangement of words...but i really doubt ___ - dash

    actually, dingosmoov has some solid advice and sounds like he isnt talking out his backside like i am, id still contact apple first

    i really doubt anyone with the word dash is paying to license it from playfirst but dingo's right, who knows
  • AddictiveGamesAddictiveGames Member Posts: 105
    Don't change your name.
    Don't contact Apple.
    Don't waste money on Lawyers.

    Simply email them back and say NO for the following reasons:

    1) "Dash" is a verb that has been used in Games long before PlayFirst
    2) There is no way your games can be confused
    3) There are hundreds of other Apps using the Dash name
    4) Your based in Chile
    5) Your a 1-man indie developer with support from GS community and Press Contacts, any legal action would bad publicity for PlayFirst
    6) The "Doodle" and "Ville" names have recently failed exclusivity requests on the Appstore, this is just the same.

    DON'T CHANGE YOUR NAME. You have already done this once because of the confusion with the other Pig game which was the right thing to do but not this time. Don't be bullied or afraid of Playfirst. Don't change the name.
  • mangaroomangaroo Member Posts: 419
    AddictiveGames said:
    Don't change your name.
    Don't contact Apple.
    Don't waste money on Lawyers.

    Simply email them back and say NO for the following reasons:

    1) "Dash" is a verb that has been used in Games long before PlayFirst
    2) There is no way your games can be confused
    3) There are hundreds of other Apps using the Dash name
    4) Your based in Chile
    5) Your a 1-man indie developer with support from GS community and Press Contacts, any legal action would bad publicity for PlayFirst
    6) The "Doodle" and "Ville" names have recently failed exclusivity requests on the Appstore, this is just the same.

    DON'T CHANGE YOUR NAME. You have already done this once because of the confusion with the other Pig game which was the right thing to do but not this time. Don't be bullied or afraid of Playfirst. Don't change the name.

    i wouldnt contact them about it as that may require them to take it further. they maybe just doing as dingosmoov said and just portraying the image of protecting their trademark with no real followup intention. i agree dont change your name so readily, but do contact apple who will hopefully realise how it affects them..
  • AddictiveGamesAddictiveGames Member Posts: 105
    Its really difficult for PlayFirst to do anything without Apple. Apple won't want to get involved.

    If Apple do contact you explain the points above, the Verb argument is a common sense one and also point out to Apple the other Apps including Zombie Dash. There is no way Apple will remove all these Dash Apps of itunes.

    The problem is indie develops get scared when they see legal blur but you shouldn't be. It would be nearly impossible and financially unjustifiable for PlayFirst to try to take you to court once you tell them your and indie and live in Chile etc.

    You have a whole brand of ePig games with different Verbs describing the movement in the game. Dash is relevant here, not confusing with their food/hotel management games and its very easy for you to prove you have not infringed their property. I think Apple will agree with you.

    Be brave and only re-name if Apple ask you to. Be brave.
  • LuckyLurcherLuckyLurcher Member Posts: 343
    UtopianGames said:
    I would throw it in the bin....like someone said above Boulder Dash was made before these games.

    In fact i might make a quickie and call it Dash Dash Dash:)

    Darren.

    +1

    Don't acknowledge them unless they take further action.
  • calvin9403calvin9403 Member Posts: 3,186
    like someone said b4, playfirst does not use "dash" first

    so I think it's not necessary to change your name

    Calvin

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