new game salad?

starcat

ok, so i keep being told my games are to vast and too big gamesalad cant handle it. ive been told this by a lot of people and i know tshirt knows what im talking about. and i just got news that game salad has no intention of re-writing or updating the code so it has better load times or can handle more memory or any such thing. is this true?

i hear that it wont make them any more money because people who dont wanna code will still use game salad despite its terrible memory limitations.

if this is true how disappointed i am

Photics

starcat said:
i just got news that game salad has no intention of re-writing or updating the code so it has better load times or can handle more memory or any such thing. is this true?

That's not what I read.

One of the people at GameSalad posted on this forum about the image loading trick. I was advised not to use the trick, as then I wouldn't be able to take advantage of image loading improvements in the future. I still use the trick, as it's not hard to switch back to the normal way of loading images. The point is that it clearly suggests that optimizations are coming.

GameSalad recently received 6.1 million dollars.
I think their investors should demand improvements — I would!

gyroscope

Starcat - the guys and gals at GS HQ are dedicated to GameSalad, this much I believe. They work their socks off for certain, improving the Creator beta every time, for one. Load times and memory management is - more than likely - an ongoing process. The more complex the program becomes, the more load times/memory management becomes an issue, in my opinion. But they are far from ignoring the issue.

GS can only get better - and it is getting better each time. All down to priorities and time, I guess; but they'll get there...

So relax a bit, I say; go with the flow! :-)

gamedivision

yeah i received an email yesterday from GS explaining that they are working on the loading times.
so here's my fingers crossed

starcat

i hope what you are saying is true. because im hearing from quite a few people that they cant make the games they want because of the way game salad accumulates memory instead of getting rid of it. the only reason i bring this up is because someone told me that everyone would continue to use GS otherwise, and it wouldnt really make them more money, would just make people happier.

RedlerTech

Hmm starcat, not sure how big your game is , but would developing it for mac fix these issues?

Matt

starcat

im not sure. im still noob to gs. i dont know what causes crashes or what not. i dont know if its the platform its on or something in GS or what.

RedlerTech

Anyone know the limits of development (GS) for mac?

steve86

pretty much the sky is the limit with the mac. You dont have to worry too much about memory limitations.

quantumsheep

uptimistik said:
Yeah I would suggest you wait at least 5 years before you attempt making anything with GS. By then they would have worked out all the kinks....and I hate more competition. So don't bother with GS for now.

Thanks for making the sheepy snort!

@Starcat
I understand your concerns, but in the interest of balance I will say this:

There are plenty of people making games with GameSalad, uploading to Apple, and getting games into players' grubby paws.

I will keep saying it: It is not the SDK, it is the person behind it.

Now, I'm not blind. I would certainly appreciate more features, and tighter memory management, faster loading times etc etc

But this does not physically stop me, and others, making games. Some of which are pretty darn good.

If you discount the pro features, then we all use the same set of behaviours. All of us.

I understand people needing something to take their frustrations out on. But this constant whining (I'm not talking about you starcat) about the limitations of GS is BS.

It works. People use it. People have been successful with it.

The rest is down to your own ability and luck.

Cheers,

QS

EDIT - as to the memory issues specifically, I and other sous chefs are badgering the GS team all the time about this. And we'll do it till they're sick of us and just make the adjustments to shut us up

starcat

well im working on a game in particular thats a castlevania / metroid style game with Tons of areas , constrains , enemies walking about. spawning items.. money, upgradable weapons , musical score etc. theres a lot going on. its not a simple game. and even with peak optimization ive been told it will have like 6 second loading times

so i thought i'd inquire

RedlerTech

Well, Starcat's game is going to have around 60 constraints at one time. Let's all take a vote if you think GS can handle it, in each platform:

iPhone: No.
iPad: Possibly, most likely not
Mac: Most likely

Eastbound

I'd like to know why 60 constrains are necessary. With a little info on what you're trying to accomplish here I think its pretty likely that could be optimized better.

RedlerTech

Sorry Eastbound, I'm under NDA & cannot say. Around 60 constraints are necessary, can't say why. I can say that many actions are necessary to give this project "a good feeling". It's one of those games, that if you developed it it in GameSalad, the community would absolutely flip out. COMPLETELY.

Matt

quantumsheep

starcat said:
well im working on a game in particular thats a castlevania / metroid style game with Tons of areas , constrains , enemies walking about. spawning items.. money, upgradable weapons , musical score etc. theres a lot going on. its not a simple game. and even with peak optimization ive been told it will have like 6 second loading times

so i thought i'd inquire

Oh, for sure.

But if NextGen's the one giving you advice, I really wouldn't listen.

Just to fill you in - Air Supply 2 will be a game very similar to yours. With different game modes planned, a massive soundtrack, multiple unlocks/avatars/backgrounds/achievements/enemies/levels etc...

I'm not starting it till about December probably - but I do not forsee any problems. I could be wrong of course! But by then 3GS will probably be the base model offered by Apple, and that should run it fine.

There are creative ways around issues if you have the experience. Sure, loading between levels will take a few seconds, but there are ways of minimising that. 60 constraints just sounds ridiculous, for example.

If you're determined to do this as your first game, then yes, you may run into problems. If you release, or just plain finish another simpler type of game, your 'mega' game will benefit greatly from it.

Just some friendly advice

QS

JohnPapiomitis

NextGen said:
Sorry Eastbound, I'm under NDA & cannot say. Around 60 constraints are necessary, can't say why. I can say that many actions are necessary to give this project "a good feeling". It's one of those games, that if you developed it it in GameSalad, the community would absolutely flip out. COMPLETELY.

Matt

@ nextgen If you got hired to do this then you should be doing everyhting in your power to optimize it first, not tell him that gs cant handle it. not proffesional at all. I can almost guarentee me or some of the other guys would be able to cut that 60 attributes down with some creative thinking.

@starcat no offense but you might have hired the wrong person for the project

quantumsheep

JohnPapiomitis said:
@ nextgen If you got hired to do this then you should be doing everyhting in your power to optimize it first, not tell him that gs cant handle it. Not professional at all.

@starcat no offense but you might have hired the wrong person for the project

GET OUT OF MY HEAD!!!!

JohnPapiomitis

quantumsheep said:
GET OUT OF MY HEAD!!!!

WHATS GOING ON IN HERE?! IM FREAKIN OUT MAN!

;D

RedlerTech

quantumsheep said:
But if NextGen's the one giving you advice, I really wouldn't listen.

QS, what makes you doubt my skills? The games I've seen developed from you is Air Supply, a SIMPLE run & jump game with a friendly interface & bright colors. The other one? Tshirtbooth's template with different images. I don't tell people to doubt your skill, why do you do with mine? I reply to help threads often, & spend hours a day on project help. I think my GS skills are great, who are you to say otherwise?

RedlerTech

@John
I am hired as a "programming assistant" guys, relax. I already have planned MUCH to improve memory management and loading times which I have discussed with him. Not to worry. Either way, with anyone doing this project that we have planned; it will be rough.

JohnPapiomitis

NextGen said:
QS, what makes you doubt my skills? The games I've seen developed from you is Air Supply, a SIMPLE run & jump game with a friendly interface & bright colors. The other one? Tshirtbooth's template with different images. I don't tell people to doubt your skill, why do you do with mine? I reply to help threads often, & spend hours a day on project help. I think my GS skills are great, who are you to say otherwise?

Because me and countless other users have fixed projects that you have been hired to do, and ive personally fixed stuff for you and you know that. And all the fixes everytime have been standard knowledge that anyone selling a service should know. You were trying to say there was this big bug in gamesalad that wouldnt let you have your splash screen, and i fixed it in 2 seconds with common knowledge about gamesalad artwork. Im not trying to attack you, but your just being a ass now

O and maybe you should have actually look at all of qs games before saying something.

jonmulcahy

NextGen said:
QS, what makes you doubt my skills? The games I've seen developed from you is Air Supply, a SIMPLE run & jump game with a friendly interface & bright colors. The other one? Tshirtbooth's template with different images. I don't tell people to doubt your skill, why do you do with mine? I reply to help threads often, & spend hours a day on project help. I think my GS skills are great, who are you to say otherwise?

Woah. Air supply was more than a simple runner, and his game attack of the kracken was a huge game that ran like butter. I don't think I've ever seen you produce a game.

gyroscope

quantumsheep said:
GET OUT OF MY HEAD!!!!

DreamLab

*PAUSE*

Lemme go get the popcorn!

GamersRejoice

I don't think I would feel right charging people money without releasing a few games of my own first.

GameSalad definitely has it's strengths and weaknesses as does just about everything in life. The challenge is finding ways to make what you want work, on the platform you're working with. This goes for anything, If I'm drawing a picture and want to color it, it's going to be two different methods depending on whether I use Photoshop or Illustrator.

eXtraTurnGames

Has anyone released a guide about optimizing gamesalad? Things to avoid doing as much as possible and workarounds if you must do them?

tenrdrmer

JohnPapiomitis said:
@ nextgen If you got hired to do this then you should be doing everyhting in your power to optimize it first, not tell him that gs cant handle it. not proffesional at all. I can almost guarentee me or some of the other guys would be able to cut that 60 attributes down with some creative thinking.

@starcat no offense but you might have hired the wrong person for the project

Careful with a personal attack like that against NextGen. Man your getting a little close to my "Biggest Ass on the Forum" title. I have worked very hard to achieve that and am not gonna give it up easily.

RedlerTech

Haha No worries, John's my friend :P

BBEnk

I think Gamesalad is the most awesome game making software ever. I think it's what everyone wants because it brings game making to almost anyone with the imagination to use it and someday it will be the standard by which all others or compared not the other way around.

UtopianGames

I honestly don't think there's a need to hire anyone to do coding in GS....I have a large client base of customers but i always tell them it's better and more importantly cheaper to learn the engine yourself.

There's a ton of tutorials, videos and of course this excellent forum to ask questions.

There's still a lot i can't do without having a good old think or trial and error and I'm far from an expert with GS but the satisfaction you get from cracking it is well worth the effort.

Guess what I'm saying is have a bloody good go at it yourself before hiring someone and when your up and running you will find ways of working round certain GS constraints.

I have always said....play to the strengths of the engine and design your games around this. If you physically can't do what you want to do in GS move on to another engine or design another game.

Darren.

gyroscope

UtopianGames said:
...play to the strengths of the engine and design your games around this. Darren.

Worth quoting that! :-)