Copyright Q. (will apple approve this?)

JakeMor

Hey everyone,

the current game I'm working on includes silhouettes of characters like mickey mouse, bugs bunny, etc. The images are completely white, and only outline the real character. Would apple see this as copyright infringement? I don't see how this is any different than what the game "logos quiz" does - so would this be acceptable?

SinSquid

I will say no. And if it goes through the apple review/cencour, you don`t want to mess with the Disney company. These characters are copyrighted as %&#. I think the logo game is different, because the logos are part of a quiz, and it gains the company to have their logo exposed (free comercial for them). But I wouldn`t be suprised if the logo game is removed after a while.

Copyrights are a serious matter, and in worst case you could get in big trouble, especially with companies that big And if your game should become a hit, or have great sales, they will for sure come after you.

Mickey mouse is set to be a public figure in 2023 (unless Disney extends this, and I´ll guess they will), so until then dont touch him.

But what you could do, is change them a bit, and don`t use their names. I`ve seen cartoon ripofs with Micky Mouse as a drug addict and with different name, where they made the character look like the originals but with no doubt it`s him. Give him poiny ears insted of round ears, or make him a rat insted of a mouse etc.

Be inspired by disney, but don`t use disney, will be my recomendation. Best of luck

BarrytheBrave

Agreed it's best to avoid using copyrighted characters for sure. I get the point about the logo quizzes, I'm not entirely sure how they get away with that either, unless logos fall in to a different legal category than characters?

It's good to keep a sense of realism though, in all reality it's very unlikely that Disney would go to the trouble of launching a court case against an individual for making a small iphone game from their own house (unless said game got really popular), but the likelihood is that either it would never get approved by Apple in the first place, or if it did get approved it would probably be taken down pretty quickly when somebody complained.

So the only real advice anyone can give, which you probably already expect, is to avoid copyrighted assets entirely.

pixelknights

Agreed it's best to avoid using copyrighted characters for sure. I get the point about the logo quizzes, I'm not entirely sure how they get away with that either, unless logos fall in to a different legal category than characters?

For one, the app is free, so they are not making any sort of revenue from it (I'm not sure if they have iAds or not, can't remember, but ads wouldn't make a difference really).

There's another quiz out now (in UK anyway, pretty sure its everywhere) called Font Quiz. This shows one letter from a company's name logo e.g Lego. This is a free app with iAds, and he has a button which opens a window stating:

"All logos shown or represented in this game are copyright or trademark of their respective owner"

I *assume* if you make a message similar to that in your game and make it a FREE one, I think you won't have any problems (emphasis on the word assume, i',m not 100% sure).

BarrytheBrave

Yeah that may be it @MikeZteel.

Still, I wouldn't want to be making a game using Disney and Warner characters, whether it has a disclaimer or not!

Sparkyidr

We once had an app rejected because we had a font that looked like the disney font in it.

They are pretty harsh with stuff that might infringe on Disney IPs.

pixelknights

@ooi - I suppose the line is drawn when you use characters in the quiz. I guess if you use a logo or company name it's not such of a big deal (hence why the current quiz apps are still on the store). But when you use a character e.g. Mickey Mouse, it's then where companies tend to get all Goofy with you (yes Goofy the Disney character)

JamieOneil

This sounds like my app (WIP).
In mine its black silhouettes and you tap them and guess what it is...

BarrytheBrave

But when you use a character e.g. Mickey Mouse, it's then where companies tend to get all Goofy with you (yes Goofy the Disney character)

I see what you did there - High five! =;

jamie_c

Disney is ruthless with their copyrights and characters. Even if your app is free and it uses Disney characters shapes (or others) it still reflects on those charcters and the company that owns them, and the owners of the characters always want to be in control of how they are used.

jamie

pixelknights

@ooi - =; back at you :P

Braydon_SFX

I've actually been in contact with Warner Bros. and let me say - they are Very harsh. I didn't contact that about a character, but about an issue for some text. I wouldn't risk putting that out there. You don't want to wake up on a Monday morning only to have police waiting for you...

Just me two cents.

JakeMor

firstly, thanks for all the responses, these prompt replys are what makes this community so strong.

I will say no. And if it goes through the apple review/cencour, you don`t want to mess with the Disney company. These characters are copyrighted as %&#. I think the logo game is different, because the logos are part of a quiz, and it gains the company to have their logo exposed (free comercial for them). But I wouldn`t be suprised if the logo game is removed after a while.

Mine is a quiz as well, and you don't need to type in the whole characters name (for example - mickey is accepted as an answer as opposed to mickey mouse, and bart is accepted rather than the full bart simpson.

What if I removed all the Disney characters? Disney and Apple have close ties and excluding them might prevent litigation... what do you guys think?

pixelknights

It's hard to give you a proper answer without saying stuff e.g "Disney is not going to like that". If you want to be 100% sure you can use what you want to use, contact the companies and explain what you are going to do etc... You might get some who will say no, and some will say yes. If you go down this route, I hope the positive replies will outshine the negatives.

JakeMor

I've already put so much work into it, I'm going to send it in and take my chances. There's always android as well

JakeMor

(I can also add a copyright notification saying the images shown are my own iterations)

granted, I did get them off google, however I changed them into outlines.

rhinokey

(I can also add a copyright notification saying the images shown are my own iterations)

granted, I did get them off google, however I changed them into outlines.

then that's breaking even more laws!
converting images snagged on Google into outlines is not really creating your own iterations. as a pro game artist i would severely frown to see someone grab my work do a minute of Photoshop work, then claim its their own work.

you seem to be missing the big picture here, which is not if apple will pass it. its laws you are possibly(most likely yes) and the repercussions that it could have for you. i just don't think its a good idea to risk it. and i don't think its a good idea to infringe on others ip without at least contacting them.

slowcut

Hi, few weeks ago i have started a german logo quiz and have asked some companies if I can use their logo. I have stopped asking after 160 requests because only 15 (!!!) gave me the permission to use their logo. And the big ones (Audi, BMW, VW, Deutsche Bank, etc) they all have strict rules about their logos, no one is allowed to use their copyright material and they refuse to give permissions or make exceptions. So you can imagine what the logo-quiz quys had done, no one of them has asked for permissions. So if you ask Disney they will say no, but I think Apple will approve your app as long as you don't have their apple inside your app. That's the reason why Apple is not included in all of the logo quiz games. Good luck

JakeMor

(I can also add a copyright notification saying the images shown are my own iterations)

granted, I did get them off google, however I changed them into outlines.

then that's breaking even more laws!
converting images snagged on Google into outlines is not really creating your own iterations. as a pro game artist i would severely frown to see someone grab my work do a minute of Photoshop work, then claim its their own work.

you seem to be missing the big picture here, which is not if apple will pass it. its laws you are possibly(most likely yes) and the repercussions that it could have for you. i just don't think its a good idea to risk it. and i don't think its a good idea to infringe on others ip without at least contacting them.

I highly doubt any of the big companies will contact me, and if they do it will be after the game is successful. I'm not really interested in the morality of the act so much as whether or not it would be accepted by Apple. I'm sure Disney's character designers won't take it as a personal insult.

pixelknights

Hi, few weeks ago i have started a german logo quiz and have asked some companies if I can use their logo. I have stopped asking after 160 requests because only 15 (!!!) gave me the permission to use their logo.

Dude, that's a shame. It's free advertising for them, I am not sure why they would refuse. If it was a paid app then yeah I don't blame them for rejecting, because your making money from their logo essentially. But if its free, then there's no harm is there, really? But I guess that's the way the cookie crumbles.

slowcut

@ mikezteel The main argument was , that they want to have control over their marketing campaign, and yes it's a shame. They spend millions of dollars for advertising but refuse the free marketing. I think the logo quizzes are strong for brand recognizing...But most of the are much too oldskool and have not heard about the new stuff. And many of the little clerks in the press offices are too anxious to give permissions and so they just say no to stay out of trouble

pixelknights

@slowcut - I guess that they have a point with wanting to control their marketing.

Quiz type games are popular now aren't they, why not take a look at the app-store and see what type of quiz has not yet been made (that's what I have done, and I am in the middle of building my quiz now).

JustMe74

In my day job I work with a lot of big companies doing projects that involve the use of their branding guidelines, and I can tell you that the only reason the various "logo quiz" apps are still there is either because (1) the companies gave permission to use the logos or (2) they're just flying under the radar. One complaint from a company and that app will get instantly pulled.

What you want to do is even worse, and Disney is a company that is particularly aggressive about defending their IP and how its used. It's unlikely that you'll even get that far though -- Apple will most likely reject your app outright. Heck, again in my day job, I've worked on projects where we've created some apps for major networking companies and the apps were originally rejected by Apple because we submitted them under our own developer account but they were using those companies' logos. We had to get letters from their corporate attorneys stating that we had permission to use the logos. Easy to clear up in our case because it was legit, but be aware that Apple often does look at things like this especially when you're talking about a large company's IP.

Good luck.

slowcut

I have asked a bunch of companies who are very present in the logo quiz games. Most of them said that they will never give permission to others to use the logo or the brand name. So it's definetly sure that the logo quiz games are flying under the radar or that the companies are too lazy to sue them

BazookaTime

Hard to say especially when Apple approves things like Metal Slug 2012. However, I wouldn't do it.