Some one Sells a dev. kit to copy my game (Three Points)
BigDave
Member Posts: 2,239
Ridicules..
A template to build the game. Feeling flattered and annoyed at the same time.
But yeah the game is so damn simple. This wouldn't really be required to clone it.
http://www.chupamobile.com/ios-full-games/three-points-cocos2d-x-ios-android-5766
Comments
Just take it as compliment, your game is clone worthy.
Fortuna Infortuna Forti Una
Yeah, stuff like that sucks. That's why we need the project encryption that the GS team are working on stabilizing.
"Easy Reskin!" lol
@JSproject How does encryption help from someone just making the game from scratch. It's still a clone. Are you all saying his app was "back engineered" so to speak and they got the exact GS file? Is this the same thing that happened to @FatFish ?
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@Thunder_Child In general: with encryption in place it will be very hard and very time consuming (if not impossible) for someone to clone a complex app. Without encryption the same task is quite easy really (for GS apps).
This is why I'm now putting all my efforts on making a proper more in-depth game, I'm sick of all the quick clones! you can't even ask for help with something theses days without someone taking the code that is posted as help and making your game!! lol
I actually created from scratch a clone of your game and will be releasing it in the new Gamesalad Marketplace. The mechanics as you've said is indeed simple, so it makes as a perfect example for an educational, first-timers' learning template.
However as a responsible template creator, I felt it my duty to at the very least create original art assets - and to market it more as an educational template and not a ready-for-publishing file (it's bundled with a comprehensive .PDF that explains the Rules of each Actor, instructions on how to tailor art assets for it in Photoshop, challenge exercises for advanced mechanics, etc). See it here: http://imgur.com/QCv39Kn
The release you linked seemed to have stolen everything there is about your game and just decided to throw-in the word "clone" in the description.
I think you can report that one c/o cloning your art and game name alone.
Yup, same thing happened to us. However Chupamobile do this differently, as they've not stolen the project, just reengineered the game in a different game engine, as stated in their template's description.
Sorry to hear this @BigDave It's sad to see another one of us get ripped off. It is flattering but also highly frustrating to see someone else pocket good money for your own ideas/mechanics. Like you say, the game isn't deep in terms of game mechanics, so it can be so easily cloned, but I absolutely despise Chupamobile now and how they deal with this situation and willingly support their cloning members, who are probably earning more money than the actual game being cloned themselves!
We've been in touch with Chupamobile for selling template clones of three of our games. Sadly they view this act as totally fine and acceptable and would not remove them. Even though in all the template descriptions they are listed as clones of our games, including screenshots and links to them! This isn't on, but they wouldn't remove them as there is no infringing parts to the template being sold AFAIK. If you had buckets of money there is a case through legal channels but that is far too costly than its worth, unless it was an established IP/brand that you had legal owning writes to its name, identity etc. But it all costs a pretty penny and it will no doubt cost more than that game has ever brought in!
This is fast becoming a common problem with successful/popular simple mechanic games. If your art is stolen, you have a stronger case on getting it removed, but when it consists of simple geometric shapes, then you might not have much weight to force any kind of removal.
The best you can do here is monitor the App Stores and make copyright/infringing removal claims on the games that show up. Sadly though, this doesn't effect the person selling the template or chupamobile, but the (possibly unexpecting) individuals that have bought it.
Even though it would affect the person buying it, it would also affect the template site. The user would be more weary about buying another template again. Since Apple seems to be getting more strict on whats allowed, hopefully this puts some of these scammer sites under. I still don't understand why any developer would support this kind of websites. Its all fun and games until your game is the one getting ripped.
Fortuna Infortuna Forti Una
Yeah I would focus on making a really good game that no one can clone! Then you won't have to worry about someone stealing your ideas.
@raycur09 because many people see that apps can earn a lot money, so that they use most simple way to sell apps with buying other people published apps template or clone the apps. For me, earning the store getting harder and harder.
@BigDave you have the power man
just make a better game 
forget all these quick addictive games! the market is shifting to a paid marketplace again! just make a game worthy of putting it up as £0.69p $0.99!!!!
good luck man
j
Sorry to hear about the clone @BigDave
Damn ! Just read this stuff ! . . .
"This game is just starting to take off on Android and iOS so be one of the first to get a clone up on Android or iOS!"
. . . it's an invite to people to cash in on your work, these people are pretty despicable, I think a lot of game template making in general is damaging, and downright immoral where it directly copies other people's work, but I'd say this was even worse.
These people are not just selling your designs on the open market, but also offering to reskin and upload the clone to the App Store/Google Play for people with no design or development knowledge, basically opening up your work not just to developers looking to rip you off but now to just about anyone.
So you work away on your game for weeks or months, once completed chupamobile then helps themselves to your work, copies every part of it and then sells it to some bored 17 year old kid who has ever even heard of game development, you or Xcode, and this kid, having made zero effort or put in none of the work, gets to upload your game to the App Store under his name.
How is this stuff even still legal or allowed ?
It's pretty depressing knowing that these vultures are circling the App Store, helping themselves to whatever they want.
@jay2dx thanks man always uplifting to hear some kind words.
@FallingBoxStudios Jeah sucks but what ever some how everything "steals" from another we all come from the big bang..
@Socks Jeah.. maybe clones even put more attention to the original because i still have the original name all others are just variations..
Overall I do this now full time since one year and Three Points was my 20th app.
So far none of the apps made really noticeable money. But I see em as learnings and progress its just a matter of keep on doing it.
This month was the first profitable.
iAd made 800 usd
chartboost (late implementation -3 weeks to late) made 200 usd this week
my artist/partner sabba keynejad made a deal with a guy from California we made em a clone of four points for 2000 usd which was good money
So this month was around 3000 usd
which i split 50% with sabba because he made my concept big and helped form em into perfect simple versions.
I just think its an extreme hard business and I would suggest no one to start with games that take to long and rather go for a lot of quick learnings until you know what the crowd thinks is a good game and not your own Ego. I still sometimes struggle with that and end up shipping small games that feel really fun to work on but once i shipped and some time passed I realize that they are not as awesome as it felt to build em and they way to inaccessible for the crowd.
This whole cloning doesn't bother me as hard since I don't think that there is something like the ultimate idea or concept there is an endless amount of ideas that wants to be expressed, no reason to be locked in to a specific.
The only wish I really have is that I can keep on doing and stop worrying about money.
Thats the dream…
Got roughly money left until March 2015.
So back to work.
My Apps
https://itunes.apple.com/de/artist/david-zobrist/id733552276
https://play.google.com/store/apps/developer?id=David+Zobrist&hl=de
Yeah, this sucks. It happened to me. I went around getting the clones that were popping up all over the place removed from Google and Apple but eventually I realised my efforts were better put elsewhere.
Just sucks that when you make a game that isn't particularly successful (I'm referring to mine, not yours, lol), these ripoffs can really hurt. I wouldn't have been so pissed if my game had been a hit in the first place.
But yeah, I feel your pain.
That's my plan now. Make stuff that's not so easily ripped off.
I really hope your joking!!!!
Why is that? It's like you didn't read my entire comment.
It's a bare bone template that's inspired by his game that looks and feels like a system-esque tutorial. Rather than giving someone the complete clone that's ready for publishing, it is instead designed to focus on teaching and explaining the different concepts covered in creating a game like @BigDave's Three Points through a comprehensive learning guide. For Gamesalad beginners, they will learn the basics and benefits of creating Single-Scene games, the advantages of making use of only Prototype Actors, how to implement an efficient High Score system, etc. There are also challenge exercises for intermediate developers.
I've also included an entire learning section devoted to designing art for the template. Lots of concepts to learn from the original game, really. If you've tried re-skinning his Art assets, you'd realise that it is actually not that easy. For instance, if you were to recreate the spinning triad, you can't just create your triangle and center that to your image. You actually have to play with geometric designs a bit. Here's a freebie:
As Dave's game continues to get bigger, more and more clones will pop up trying to cash-in on the trend; but he's already accepted that, which is one thing you seem to have not yet come to terms with. Out of some respect, I will be cashing-in instead on the educational value of his original design.
Phew! Massive shameless plug, over. I really don't enjoy defending myself in these situations
Does anyone else see the problem with this? Pretty crappy way to make money, educational or not, using someone else's work.
Cloning games is not good for the marketplace. However @TheGabfather hasn't cloned Three Points just made similar gameplay. There were many games similar to Three Points well before it was released so it is not the 'Original'. I don't believe you should be promoting a template that is of another persons game on their own thread.
What you are doing is still taking another persons game and trying to generate revenue from that even if you dress it up as being of "educational value". If you honor what @BigDave has done then you may want to consider giving part of your income from this template to him since that would be the right thing to do.
Guilty with this one, couldn't resist. Thanks for pointing it out and let me apologize to @BigDave for that.
__
On the topic of making a bare bone template that is 'inspired by a hit-game' though, I'm surprised everyone else looks at this as a fantastic form of theft of intellectual property - without even seeing the actual template.
Dave created this thread to bring awareness regarding blatant clones of Gamesalad games. I share the same sentiment against such clones.
The stand I was trying to make here though, is responsible template-making whilst borrowing hit ideas of existing games. And no, it is not wrong to borrow an idea and build on it. If you will argue with this, then you'd better present your case in such a way that you do not solely base it on sentiment or honor. Indie game development might just be a fun past time for some people, but for the rest of us it is a combination of being a passion for game development AND as a business. If you don't get my drift, well then, that's that.
in the end, I probably won't win this one against ya'll tho.
Just my 2 cents
Big dave well done mate on the game apart from the dosh, living the dream but still an inspiration to all and thank you for sharing like you said just keep trying. I totally agree at the statement of doing things that you think are fun for you but not nessaceraly for the audience but surly this will one day become what the audience wants.
On the clone subject of gab father its a similar concept yes but come on guys how many games are already clones. Every platformer is a clone of mario at some level different art etc and how many box crate destroy games have you created or similar my new games hold attributes of multiple games out there like gab father said it can be educational plus he did tell us, not bein sneaky bout it gains few points in my book.
A complete clone however is a no no especially if they stole the original in the first place
Can i also say i am totally independent and don't wish to p@%s anyone off with my comments just friendly chat yol
P.s GS Rocks
(Edit) my view may change if happened to me (Angry Face)..........
I've never ever used a template. I use code snippets and the templates I do sell are basically game engine basics. Reskining a template doesn't make one a game developer/creator. It just makes you a business person.
To each his own but @RP and I prefer to develop our own ideas/concepts. We want to be ahead of the curve not on it.
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Nothing is completely original these days ... People jus lack creativity and imagination and that is the issue ... They don't want to think. The easy way is to take someone else's idea and just duplicate it as the thinking is already done for you. The thinking is the hard part. Once you know what your are going to do it is easy. There is nothing wrong with templates. You learn from them and gain new ideas to create something new. It's people's actions that make it wrong ... Like we have electricity you can light up a house with it or you can electricute someone with it ... People are the ones that make something good or bad ... Just my two cents
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@TheGabfather Because its ridicules! and a waste or your time.
Its a simple game that anyone could ask someone on the forums with some knowledge how to do, I really don't see how making a tutorial for it is "something to be made" are people scrabbling for this game "NO" they are not!, its not the same as the flappy bird sensation that swept the app stores! basically design your own game and make a tutorial for that! not 3 points! add something and make it your own, not just a change of graphics!!
I have a game exactly the same as Daves that I had "advice" code posted to the forums on how to achieve, this was well before Daves game was even out! I could make a tutorial and template from that! ie my game ive already got! but im not!,, Ive now held back my game to make it fully featured and not simply a quick and simple game, and now putting a lot more effort into to! so what I mean is, make something different! I fail to see how you can justify yourself with what your saying. Im happy for dave for getting his game to the top through social media etc it was a great spout of luck and massive achievement for him for a while, but it was just that, its fell from the top spots now and needs another media push, as it was a tad too simple and one directional so the replay value is not there really.
If you look at my game on ios you'll see that mine are mainly clones but ive added something to the gameplay, ive only been doing this since January so was a learning curve for me, and a great one, but I didn't use templates as they are not needed, we have a great community here, don't spoil it by ripping the GS community peoples games and releasing templates! or the forums will die as no one will ever post code or games for fear of this! I know ive stoped!!!
I think what im saying is put your efforts into something that will be a great game not an exact clone!
Jay
I would be fine with this if the guy was releasing a game to the stores but changed the gameplay and made it his own, im just not happy with templates!! as its been said though, its all business to some people!
agree, snipets of code to learn, down with templates of peoples games!
I'm sorry Jay, but I will no longer attempt to defend my position. I get the impression that you simply skimmed through my prior explanations regarding how I design my templates (which I've redacted with respect to Dave) and paid no real attention to the points I made.
Thanks for your genuine passion with regards to your stance on the issue, though. Keeps the community healthy and thinking.
ok dude, no problem, but maybe take it further and add in some kind of power ups, slow motion, change in colours on events/goals reached, score multiplier! screen shake, things like that, that's what makes a tutorial/template worth selling! this is simply THE game re-skinned! anyone could find out how to make this by reading the forum!