* A Special Announcement For Our Community *

superNES · September 2009

We'd like to thank you all for making these forums such a great and positive place to hang out and learn about game design and GameSalad. This has so far been an amazing journey for all of us here at Gendai Games, and we're only getting started! As a show of appreciation, we're going to open up the iPhone Early Access Program to all of you ahead of our planned launch date. That means starting today, you can create iPhone games with GameSalad - before we make the availability public.

So here's the deal:

All the remaining questions regarding pricing and how this will work can be found in the Early Access page. From here you can sign up and be on your way to making iPhone games.

For information on how to sign and create iPhone profiles and certificates for your app, visit:

If you have trouble with a specific step on the Wiki or a suggestion for improvement, please post your thoughts on these forums so we can improve our documentation. During these first weeks, we ask for your patience for any issues that you may experience.

If there's a question you have that isn't covered in the wiki, then feel free to ask your fellow community members here or do some research around the Web for answers. Once your app is converted to Xcode, you are essentially going through the same steps that every other iPhone developer has to go through. Also, as an iPhone Developer, remember that you have access to Apple's own extensive documentation library (and tools) - I highly encourage you to start there if you need additional help.

In order to start using the publishing system, you'll need to use the 0.5.0 version of GS Creator. It can be downloaded here:

Also, for the time being, we will be distributing GameSalad Viewer (the app used to quickly play/test your game on the iPhone) as an Xcode project. That means in order to build onto your device, you need to be an official Apple Developer. The new Viewer can be downloaded from the Project Management section of our website (the big orange button that currently says "Early Access Coming Soon". It'll change after you sign up at the above link.) One additional change with GameSalad 0.5.0 is that in order to use the Viewer, you must activate your subscription within the tool. The Wiki contains an instructions page devoted to building the Viewer - please refer to that for more details.

Again, thank you all for coming along on this ride with us. We know there will be some great things coming from you guys. We look forward to seeing your games on the App Store.

sewinston · September 2009

Yippy!

Toby · September 2009

OMG.... So excited. Everyone in the community jump in and have a go. This will be cool!

gpoppi · September 2009

hi people , I've been following gamesalad's progress for a while and i have just noticed that you have completed it. Congratulations!
I was wondering though if there is a way of making games for the iphone and exporting them to xcode without the gamesalad viewer. is it possible??

Toby · September 2009

Waiting on my activation email

ho - hum. Is there anything new we should know about with Beta 0.5.0 - Features (Apart from the obvious) - eg new behaviours, snappier performance etc

$500 is pretty reasonable too.

gpoppi · September 2009

people is there any way to export the application to xcode without the early access program??
there is no way i am paying 500 dollars for this. i , actually had been expecting the price to be about 100 dollars maximum!!!
I don't mean to say that in a mean way but seriously i have not got the money to afford this!! lol

CodeMonkey · September 2009

HalfMoon · September 2009

$500 isn't that far off of the pricing for Unity & once you get into the pro license then iTorque is an alternative. It just seems like a lot of money for a 'relatively' basic sdk to me. I guess if someone wants a drag & drop system without needing to learn to code then it'll sell but still seems a bit steep...

JGary321 · September 2009

Seems right on the money to me (no pun intended)

I like the price. It's low enough that people can afford it. But high enough to keep crap from flooding the app store, like farting apps did a while back.

SDMG · September 2009

$500 is fun... but 1999$ is more than steep... so how long will this splashscreen be visible? just for the time the game needs to load or for an extra amount of time?

quantumsheep · September 2009

I think it depends on the game size and the device type.

One game for me shows the splashscreen for 16 seconds on an iphone 3GS.

Same game shows the splashscreen for 30 seconds on an ipod touch 1st gen.

An *earlier* version of the game (so less big) shows the splashscreen for 24 seconds on the ipod.

I wouldn't mind so much if you could tap the screen to proceeed to your game. It's kinda what I do on my games - I put in a company splash screen, but you can always press the screen to skip it if you want!

Cheers.
QS

OH!!!! AND WE CAN MAKE iPHONE GAMES NOW!!! YIPEE!!! =D

eboy · September 2009

uhhh $2000 a year!!! for a .5 beta program...this is more then UNITY!!! remember the part where I said I hope Gendi Games doesnt screw GameSalad up with pricing...Consider it F*cked up! What are these "pro features". Oh well back to xcode.

superNES · September 2009

The load screen is up for however long it takes to load your game. It doesn't try to be up longer than it needs. This is where optimization becomes very important - remember, you're not dealing with a desktop machine anymore. Cut file sizes, trim what you're not using, and try not to shove everything into just the first scene.

eboy · September 2009

What kind of "special thanks" is GG taking about ...what bullshit, we have been waiting like fools to be able to publish to the iphone, learning the software, awaiting the promise of publishing....and then they say "finally your chance to publish is here, oh it will cost your $500 a year!!!! to try it out." what a load of crap! You guys suck....charging $500 A YEAR!! for a .5 program. I cant even try it out to publish i have to pay first. What a smack in the face. You guys just F'd yourself s. Who is going to pay $500 a year (A YEAR!!!!, Unity doesnt even do this). What crap, i am blown away. I cant believe what a diss this is....WHY GAMESALAD? WHY!!!!!! your a .5 beta program. $500a year??? No F'ing way!!!!!!! Your just a 2d, .5 beta program oh my god i am so angry....

quantumsheep · September 2009

That actually makes a lot of sense, SuperNes.

Just woke up to this, so forgive me rambling.

There is the option in the PRO version that allows you to determine a 480x320 image to be shown WHILE THE GAME LOADS.

This is replaced by the GS Logo (see here: )

Cheers,

QS

Ciggurh · September 2009

Eboy - Do you know what Unity charges for their pro version? It's $1500 for the pro tool and $1500 for the iphone addon. So $3000 total. Their indie tool is $600. So how is this more than Unity?

I purchased Unity Indie, and I'm very sorry I did cause to get any type of decent game out there, I need to be a master at C## or Javascript. I'm MORE than happy to pay LESS for an engine where I don't have to invest in that or pay half my royalties to a programmer just to make it for me.

Ciggurh · September 2009

And you also need to chill the &^% out. So what do you want to pay? $100 to make unlimited iPhone games in very little time for a platform that almost ensures that a single game will recoup your entire investment? You must be smoking something. If you find that goose that lays golden eggs, let me know...

eboy · September 2009

You are crazy, you can get indie/iphone for$1500 for Unity! GG is charing $500/1999 A YEAR!!!! Did you hear what I said? A year!!! I dont pay that much for Maya!! if you think its a good deal for a .5, 2d game engine with a basic set of features so far (you are either rich or crazy)

I could see paying a one time fee of maybe the $500 price, but a subscription of $500??? what the hell are they thinking????? And Unity is a 3d sophisticated piece of software with a three year proven record.

The games created out of GG are so far, decent at best. SO VERY ANGRY. GG stinks, they lead us on a lame ride of promises of development and a fare price for the software and then a smack in the head. It really sucks.. BLAAAA!

mainsource · September 2009

FYI, in a post here:
SNES said,

"As far as the pricing, the Early Access Program represents pricing structures that we are able to implement at this point. We hope to add different models in the future that will allow us a greater degree of flexibility".

If the current Early Access Program pricing isn't to your liking, then just don't use it. Maybe in the future, there will be a pricing option that better suits your budget. In the meantime, you can learn Objective C and Xcode for free.

quantumsheep · September 2009

I am not rich. I got made redundant recently, and half my money has gone on GameSalad.

I'm not crazy either. I'm just a time traveling sheep (oh! Wait!).

I had a look at Unity, and while very impressive, I couldn't justify spending the money on it because I'm NOT a programmer. My maths sucks too. Without a free version, I have no guarantee that I can even get close to making just ONE game that I could publish.

Thanks to GS, which is FREE, I have about 12 games I'm working on. One is with my testers right now. Another is very close to being sent out to them (hopefully this week). I hope to therefore have TWO games on the app store within two weeks if I can can get the bugs fixed and submission to Apple right first time. Though that's not GS's problem.

They're fun little games. They work. And you'll be able to BUY them soon.

BTW, while I'm here, I just wanted to big up the GS Viewer. Sous Chefs have had access to this for a little while now, and I was always disappointed that I couldn't just show my friends my games for feedback unless they were round at my place.

Also, if GS crashed, the viewer would too, and you could never tell if it was a GS problem or your game that was causing the errors.

The new GS Viewer requires that you be connected to GS only the first time you test something. After that, it stores the games and you can play them and show them to people on your phone *WITHOUT* being anywhere near GS.

Also, it might be just me, but being on your phone means your games run better. It's come on a long way and I was dead chuffed to see the 'recent games' list.

Eboy, you get GS for free (which you don't with Unity). You only pay if you want to publish.

Do you have a game ready for GS at all? As you mentioned, we've been here for months waiting for iPhone publishing.

I'd love to see it

Ciggurh · September 2009

Take a closer look and show me exactly how you can get Unity and iPhone for $1499.

Like I said, with a SINGLE decent app you will likely recoup all your costs. I will likely try to get an app out a month with GameSalad. That's 12 apps a year. Try doing that with Unity. You asked if I'm crazy or rich. I'm neither. I'm intelligent and able to see beyond my two front feet.

But if you're so sure that you'll be able to not only finish a game, but also make a profit with Unity, then by all means. Come back in a year and let us know how you're raking it in.

jhaas · September 2009

We all had to expect this. A little initial "sticker shock" by some is natural. After all, going from free to any fee will cause some grumblings no matter what you charge. Just look at the App store and see how many people complain when a .99 app doesn't have unlimited levels, instant and constant free updates and make you breakfast to boot!

I am a programmer, but Object oriented C is not my specialty. So I like having a tool to shorten the game turn around process. So you can either A) suck it up and pay what the vendor wants for their tool or

suck it up and learn to use the iPhone SDK. (Which is also free until you want to publish then it too has an annual fee.

Now that GG has announced a path forward for them to recoup some hard earned and well deserved $$. I think it's time our little group "graduates" out of the "I want something for nothing mind set". We'll get enough of that on the App store, trust me.

quantumsheep · September 2009

Or 'nothing for something'...

eboy · September 2009

Ok, i guess i am that only one upset about this (which is crazy).

You can get a Unity indie and iphone basic publishing software for $600.00 WHICH IS A ONE TIME FEE!!!!

Do you understand that they want to charge a $500/$1999 yearly subscription? You guys are cool with that????

$500/$1999 a year!!!
I love GG, but its not worth $500/1999 a year! What software charges that? (its BETA and .5!!!!) YOUR INSANE!!!!
Maya 2010 ($900 update)
Aftereffects cs4 ($200update)
Photoshop cs4 ($200 update)

these are established icons of software!!!

Good luck with your 12 drag and drop games. There are about 3000 of them all ready available.

I hate being a jerk here but GG f*cked themselves with this price model. I was ready to buy it but this price structure is such a slap in the face that I cant justify it. At least release a 1.0 product.

There is no way in the world that GG should charge more then UNITY...its is just a laugh in a half. The non programming aspect of it is amazing, but it still needs a lot of work...

jhaas · September 2009

Maya may be $900 to upgrade but it's a $3,495 package....

Apples to Oranges anyone?

quantumsheep · September 2009

Thanks for the 'good luck' - we'll all need it!

Can you show us your game now? The one that will stand head and shoulders over the 3000 drag and drop games you mention?

Cheers!

QS

sdpardue · September 2009

Like jhaas, I'm a programmer, too, probably like a lot of us who have been working with GameSalad. That's one of the reasons I appreciate how much work and creativity has gone into the software, and how much time it has already saved me, relative to coding my games from scratch.

With some decent games and reasonable pricing on the App Store, I don't think there's any way I'll lose money by paying $500 a year for as many games as I'm capable of creating. I look at it as a business investment.

As for the price structure for the 0.5.0 Beta version, from what I've seen so far, I have confidence that we'll get more functionality as it evolves to version 1.0, and by the time the first year subscription is up for renewal, it will be a more capable and far superior tool than we see today.

IMO, well worth the price.

Steve

superNES · September 2009

Hi eboy. We're very sorry you feel that the price structure is unreasonable. We've literally gone months deliberating a price that not only would provide what people are asking for (without us nickel and diming anyone to death) and still make it be sustainable for us to continue working on the tool.

You may not be aware of it, but GameSalad has been out for over a year now, and all that time it has been free and will continue to stay free. Our goal has always been about bringing game development to everyone, not just those who can pay for the tools. If we were to begin charging people to download the software, then we've failed in that goal. Because it's free, schools across our state, who normally wouldn't be able to afford licenses for a tool like Unity, have begun to use GameSalad to teach game development and game design to youngsters who wish to become professional game developers.

In that sense, we are not Unity. We do not sell software. If any comparison can be made, perhaps the Unreal engine would be more apt. They "give away" their tool with copies of their games. If, though, you wish to sell a game with their engine, that's when they charge (in the magnitude of hundreds of thousands of dollars).

When we priced our iPhone publishing model, we kept in mind what someone with little experience can expect as far as profits. To illustrate this point, our first title: Flutterby has been a success in that it helped us see what a very small game with very little marketing would profit. At its lowest selling day, that game has been purchased a minimum of around 2 times. Now that doesn't sound like much, $1.40 after Apple's cut. But if you ONLY sell the minimum for the rest of the year, then you've already paid for your subscription. And I'm sure anyone can make a better game than that. ;P

But even if your not convinced, as I mentioned in a different post, our plan is to introduce a wider variety of publishing options for all users. Hopefully then we'll have something more to your liking. Thank you for being a part of our community thus far and I hope you can see the reasoning behind our choices.

maniraptor · September 2009

Ciggurh: "for a platform that almost ensures that a single game will recoup your entire investment?"

I was at the Austin GDC and iPhone/Indie Summits last week; one of the sessions I saw was on iPhone game launching and marketing given by Brian Greenstone (President of Pangea Software). He started out with data from the Information Week report on App Store sales.

In the Paid category, 33% earned less than $250.

"So how is this more than Unity?"

Unity Indie version 2.5 is $199. Their iPhone Basic version 1.5 is $399, so the total upfront for the current Unity indie iPhone dev is $598. That is a one-time cost, not per annum. So your dev cost for the Unity SDK over 2 years is still $598.

Your equivalent 2-year cost with the GameSalad Indie SDK would be $998.

Unity Indie version upgrades are $99. Let's say for our hypothetical Year 3, they release a new version, which you purchase. Your total investment in Unity would be $697. Your equivalent investment in GameSalad would be $1498.

mainsource · September 2009

Eboy, at first I shared your sentiments, but think about it like this. At $500/year, you can pump out as many games as you want. The potential for return on your investment is huge. If you make 5 apps per month (which is easily achievable with GameSalad, thats 60 apps per year. Assuming each app only makes a modest $50 during its shelf-life, that's $3000 you grossed for the year (you net $2100 after Apple takes their cut).

And if you get lucky with the next iFart clone, you've got it made. All off of a $500 investment.

eboy · September 2009

I am not boasting about any game that I have made, I want GG to be F*cking great!!! I was counting on it for my success, but in my opinion, this price structure is outrageous for a beta software, but that is me , so go ahead any pay your $500/$1999 A YEAR.

dont for get that comes out to $1500/$6000 in 3 years.

I have currently 1 game in the app store and it's .99 and has only made about $100 so I am not sure if GG will be a win/win for me.

*** A Special Announcement For Our Community ***

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* A Special Announcement For Our Community *