@Lovejoy said:
We need a live feed to the Gamesalad offices so we can monitor the staff at work!
Only if we also get a button we can press that delivers a small electric shock to slackers, and a button that delivers coffee to people working on the features we most approve of.
@Armelline said:
Only if we also get a button we can press that delivers a small electric shock to slackers, and a button that delivers coffee to people working on the features we most approve of.
1 million funding ... again ... I sure hope its used better than the last batch of funding.
Over the 5 or so years i've been around, I see a yellow poster, gets a little active, promises this and that and then disappears.
Said guy now moves on.
Forums take a dive.
New yellow poster comes along.
Repeat process.
Yellow poster now tells of this new direction the company are heading in.
GS puts all resources into this.
GS pulls the plug on said project.
GameSalad creator remains the product that actually has this as a business, yet time and time again, mismanagement fails to focus solely on providing the product that this should now be after all these years!
Hardly open up GS these days, hardly come here these days ... Sad times!
@CodeWizard said:
Good job, BlackCloakGS! Get back to work.
You can speculate all day about what's happening in the office here if it makes you happy. I'd love to spend some time and give you more details. I might get to that this week. Will do my best. But, we're not having any problems here -- except having too much work and not enough shovels.
Oh and our revenue is doing fine, thanks! And we just landed another $1m in funding. Still going strong! More news soon!
Boosting me to Trust Gamesalad and continue on my business(Making Apps with Gamesalad and completely depend on Gamesalad) to live.
I trust that the team is hard at work making GS a stronger and more stable tool. However, my biggest issue is the horrible lack of advanced features.
We have waited and waited and waited for things like custom fonts, joints, polygon collision etc. And it seems we are no closer to having these things now than we were a year ago. I wouldn't be surprised if it was another year before any of these features were implemented in a stable form.
If GS just had custom fonts right now, I would be perfectly happy sticking with it. It is incredibly painful and time consuming to even make something as simple as a screen to display a list of stats without it looking horrible by using Display Text. I am so tired of not being able to do this easily. Frankly I don't understand how anybody can think ANY of the features we've been waiting for are more important than this. You can make a fine game without joints or polygon collision easily enough, but without custom fonts it is really difficult to make a professional looking game.
Another thing that worries me is the whole Gamesalad/Graphene relationship. It makes no sense to me to put all this effort into Gamesalad when Graphene is going to have all of it and more. Of course, we do need Gamesalad to be in a truly stable state so that people can continue to use it while Graphene is in the works. However, once that stable state is reached, they should forget about implementing the bigger features as it will only slow down Graphene development. Once Graphene is available, nobody in their right mind would continue to use Gamesalad for anything other than updating the games they already made with it. Thus the extra features would be mostly wasted in Gamesalad. I don't see how the team is ever going to have the resources to support two different programs and I don't see why they would.
I simply can't afford to wait around much longer, which is why I'm on the verge of switching to Stencyl.
Sadly, the GameSalad folks have made ALOT of rookie mistakes and don't seem to have a good finger on the pulse of the industry.
I don't doubt their technical expertise - GameSalad is a great product with LOTS of potential - but their business sense is... well... let's say they have PLENTY of room for improvement.
Sadly, it actually takes good business sense to realize you have no business sense - kind of a catch 22 situation. But once you realize that, you can outsource the business and marketing side to someone who is more experienced.
I know from running MULTIPLE businesses that you can't do it all yourself. Or at least, you can't do it all yourself very well.
My advice:
1) Outsource/hire to fill in the gaps - business and marketing. Let's face it, you either suck or are too busy to do them properly (no offense, it happens to the best of us)
2) Focus on your customers - you may have just gotten a hit of external cash, but in the long term, if you don't build and cultivate good relations with the MAJORITY of your customer base (not just your fanboi's), you're going down for the count...
3) LONGER free trial - this goes to the marketing thing. You don't have a large enough base and you aren't popular enough to be pushing away perspective customers. Give them an unlimited (or at least 30 days) free trial, but don't let them publish. In the long run, you're going to make more money from having more people use it and 15 days just isn't enough.
4) Communication - Look at the vast majority of the responses in this thread and most of them just want some communication. You know why? Because it makes them feel like they are involved and that you care about them. I'm sure you DO care about them, but if you aren't doing the things that show it, they won't know it. I have 2 ex-wives who will attest to that fact.
So, I'm off my soapbox and done giving unsolicited advice.
GS has the retention numbers.
People who pay stay.
We complain but don't leave.
Either it's Techincally impossible to add and improve UI but my guess it's cost prohibitive.
Like the snap to grid feature thread. It's probably a 20,000 $ cost to implement.
Makes no ecenomic sense to do it. Will add no revenue.
There is a distinct lake of marketing at GS. But I suppose it is hard to market a beta version of anything so maybe the recent spate of activity is aimed at getting v1.0 out the door (I hope). When they have that they can really start to market it and generate sales so they don't need injections of capital which imagine will eventually dry up. I mean who is going to keep shovelling money into a black hole eventually the investors will want a return. But hey maybe Amazon or some other company will keep doing it for reasons I don't understand.
They could then develop partner and reseller programs for other business driving more sales. I believe this is on hold at the moment or yet to be done.
The education program would be another great way to organically grow sales. Once members get accreditation they can run courses in their local area which would bring in a lot of new members from all around the world. I enquired about this a couple of weeks ago and was told it too is on hold for now.
Where is the video (Or at least a link) on the Home page showing me how easy it is to make a game using GameSalad and a bunch of other stuff? I found it, a link that is, but it wasn't easy. It should be in your face so you can't help but click it. The link took me to a page which has everything I need to know before I buy five stars to GS for that, zero stars for being obvious/well thought out. What the hell is a Crouton? I thought it was something you put in a Waldorf salad apparently it is also an art pack. When it is called an art pack I know what it is because it says what it is. I think GS is trying to be too clever and will just confuse a lot of people and make them feel like idiots for not figuring it out straight away.
They should also consider a multiple year subscription like three years for the price of two or five years for the price of three. It is always better to get a chunk of cash up front because a lot of users come and go in a short space of time. I imagine it would depend on the drop out rate if it is high this would be a good option.
A 1m cash injection after downsizing and putting Graphine on hold doesn't instil any confidence in me, it seems more like putting off the inevitable. However if in the near future I see a big flashy online marketing campaign with a lot of fanfare spooking the imminent release of v1.whatever I might then have confidence that GS is here for the long run and think part of that 1m was well spent.
GS has a great product, far superior to anything else out there that I can find that doesn't require coding. It desperately needs the services of a professional marketer who can reach out to new users and communicate the benefits of Creator in a way that excites them and shows them how easy it is to make a game using Creator.
COME ON GS start marketing your product!! I need you to stick around.
@BlackCloakGS said:
Sorry, can't talk right now coding, fixing crashes and making GameSalad better.
@CodeWizard said:
Good job, BlackCloakGS! Get back to work.
Oh and our revenue is doing fine, thanks! And we just landed another $1m in funding. Still going strong! More news soon!
Good to hear.
@Armelline said:
Only if we also get a button we can press that delivers a small electric shock to slackers, and a button that delivers coffee to people working on the features we most approve of.
Well, OK , after reading through the entire post, I remain optimistic that GameSalad will be around for a while and will improve. I would also second what @gingagaming said ....that to be responsible for ones own well being/livelihood, if making apps is how you support yourself, than learning another SDK is probably a good idea.
FWIW I suspect that the following is happening (speculation!) and I think it's important people understand.
I think new funds have come in, to enable a reset of the business around more obtainable goals while shedding some of the pressure to generate returns that may have seemed plausible at the outset of GameSalad and the original mobile app store gold rush.
I suspect My sense, and my belief is GameSalad is actually a decent business if they can keep having the support of developers like us. Good. It needs to be first-and-foremost a business that thrives as a tool business vs. other ideas like capturing a percentage of eCPM, etc.
Things have seemed more organized for a while, with the exception of recent posts from @CodeWizard that were important communications. I suspect there what happened, given his recent post, is he has been consumed by the process of securing not only the funding but an entire reset of the shareholder cap-table and business plan. Again a bit of speculation, but as someone who has helped folks raise money, this stuff is way more stressful and all-consuming than you can imagine.
I suspect that aside from the biz model reset of GameSalad Creator itself, we will see additional new revenue lines start to formulate once things settle down a bit and priorities are reset. The off-loading of the store, etc. to a partnership is a good sign that @CodeWizard is going to hyper-focus on the tool with the resources they have remaining and now-achieved.
The recent pricing shift I think represents a tough, but important choice. GameSalad needs to figure out how to better monetize what it has in place with its pro-to-hobbyist community. If it can be successful, however retrenched, with this plan, then it can work from a place of strength, rather, than the other way around which I suspect was always a plan that downplayed the value of GameSalad as a traditional tool developer and more as something that would generate revenue heavily from the output of the tool and the community in the flourishing app store marketplace.
I think the shift we're seeing is turning the original plan on its head. GameSalad will be a set of pay-for tools & services first, and then look at other upside businesses second, albeit eventually more aggressively as/if the overall situation and new investor plan takes hold well.
As a developer the long-term stability of my tool-chain supplier is a big deal. That's at the heart of many hear who have similar needs.
I'm heartened by the news of more funding, but not because of the funding itself, but because I think it's part of an overall effort that's been going on for a while toward an increase in rationality for the business itself. Many companies that are founded under economic landscapes that shift, don't often get to make such a reset.
If I'm right, even 60% consider us all a bit lucky, and give your best to the team still in-place because the seem to be fighting like hell to keep this all going.
A great thread... discusses issues that are probably high on many GS users agendas. The GS team probably don't like to see threads like this, but it helps them to see and understand the thoughts and concerns of many of their long time supporters.
Im surprised to see it coming from the ex-Guru, but totally understandable as he's often backed GS to the hilt, only to get burnt when the announce another U-turn. So when your biggest supporters are showing concern, its good to hear them out....
Im one of GS biggest supporters... although I often show it in a different way. Im very vocal about its failings and where it should really be improved. Very vocal about the awful changes in directions, and the mismanagement of assets. Ive always argued that the core engine and tool should always have been the priority, and still should be...
This is probably the third or fourth time in five years that Ive had to seriously consider my ongoing use of GameSalad... whether in a years time, the software is still going to be around to finish games Im starting now.... and to be honest, for the third or fourth time...Im not 100% convinced.
Financially... the new monthly payment system makes it easier to chew... as Im not at risk of losing a chunk of money, but thats not really the issue. The issue is one of trust. Its wanting to feel safe that if I start a new game now, that might take a year or more to develop, that its not going to be left in limbo 80% through, if GS finally kicks the bucket and closes up shop.
All the politics, changes in direction, staff layoffs, broken promises and slow development progression on engine and toolset improvements just fight against building trust, and give GameSalad a pretty negative reputation in the game dev industry... one that to be honest... is justified.
And this is where GS really need to turn things around if they are to survive, and prosper in the future. A solid, usable tool, that can be trusted, and that real game dev professionals would consider using... that then drives further reputation, and trust. They need to help developers build good games, that really show off the capabilities of the tool, rather than constantly pushing how easy it is to knock out shovel ware apps in a matter of hours or days. The software needs to start pushing out quality best sellers, that best promote the engine and tools.
Ive decided to carry on using GameSalad... at least to finish off my current batch of games... which will probably take me into early next year, but I do have that concern at the bottom of my gut, every time Im using the software, that any day, progress on my games could be stopped dead in their tracks....
More long term... I don't like having that feeling, and Im still not convinced... so I do look at, and consider switching new and future development to other engines.
Theres also the issue of GameSalads lack of viability when considering it as a tool to use, for industry job prospects. You never see any jobs advertised looking for GS developers/designers... the company has always leaned more towards the hobbyist label, and just carries no weight or realistic consideration in the games industry. Which has always been a big fail, as its where the serious subscription fees are... and limits the softwares scalability and use.
I really hope to see them take things in the right direction, as at its heart, theres an amazingly good game engine and development environment. Its just been mismanaged and not improved in the right areas. But theres still hope....
So again... After 5 years I have a lot of time invested that I don't want to throw away, and i still have games in mid development using GS...so Im along for the ride, and waiting to see what promises actually become reality this time around. But this time could well be the last....
But yup... good to see other peoples concerns, and it being discussed...
@Chunkypixels said:
Im surprised to see it coming from the ex-Guru, but totally understandable as he's often backed GS to the hilt, only to get burnt when the announce another U-turn. So when your biggest supporters are showing concern, its good to hear them out....
I don't suspect many over at the mothership realize that history. Franky as I was going to let it go past but I have to say I was a bit taken aback by,
@CodeWizard said:
You can speculate all day about what's happening in the office here if it makes you happy.
No one was speculating what anyone was doing, we were wondering about the viability of the product we purchase on an on going basis. I could have a few choice words here but I'm trying desperately here to take the high road for once. (no one is better at being an Ahole than me, I've had lots of practice trust me, hey it's gift what can I say).
Here are the facts as, @socks pointed out, this company had a major shake up in public which included revenue changes, what else can an outsider do but wonder if they may possibly wasting their time? I didn't think it was unreasonable for me a longtime PAYING customer to ask for some simple reassurances before I invest my time and more money aka hiring artists et... If that's unreasonable then I don't know what to think. Okay back to working on my multiplayer game. See I have confidence now and I will in short order be delivering the first multiplayer game using Playtogether. Oh and BTW I'm taking that on faith as this feature is not even in current builds and oh GS bought Playtogether Hmmm you think me showing their multiplayer works might inspire confidence and revenue for their acquisition? Shoot what do I know, I'm just some Ahole >:)
@Chunkypixels said...All the politics, changes in direction, staff layoffs, broken promises and slow development progression on engine and toolset improvements just fight against building trust, and give GameSalad a pretty negative reputation in the game dev industry... one that to be honest... is justified.
They guy who suggested I try GS said this exact thing to me 2 years ago. "They have a bad rep in the dev community". I didn't understand why at the time. It's very clear to me now why they COULD have a bad rep...I don't have a lot to back up my claim but if the dev community heard the news GS had a bug free final version with a non beta release people would flock to GS for at least a little while.
@Thunder_Child ...to be fair, what I should have said was: "give GameSalad a pretty negative reputation in the game dev industry... if the devs have even heard of it."
Ive worked in the games industry for close to 30 years now, primarily as an artist... so know, meet or work with a lot of coders and developers. When I mention Im developing a game with GameSalad, they often just give me a blank look... and ask "whats GameSalad?... why aren't you using Unity?"
If I have time, and GameSalad available, I'll show them... to which they're normally initially quite surprised at what its capable of.... but then when I mention things like many of the bugs, or long-time missing or incomplete features, or the biggie of having to compile builds via an online server... they quickly lose all interest. (Seems the online compiling of builds and the lack of access to code is the single biggest negative when speaking to professional developers/studios/publishers.. which is understandable)
If the other person does actually have some prior knowledge of GameSalad, its normally not positive... along the lines of... "I hear bad things about it".
Ive even had a couple of fully finished games all but sold to publishers, only to be rejected at the final hurdles, due to them being developed in GameSalad.
So yup... it misses out on a massive portion of the Game Development Industry... which is such a huge shame... both for the professional image and reputation of the software, and for its missing out on potentially lucrative subscriptions.
Comments
I Vote best post comment ever by GS staff
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Heck I'd have been happy with a we're squashing XYZ bugs et.. But I'll take concrete news anyday.
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Okay look here.
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We need a live feed to the Gamesalad offices so we can monitor the staff at work!
Fortuna Infortuna Forti Una
Only if we also get a button we can press that delivers a small electric shock to slackers, and a button that delivers coffee to people working on the features we most approve of.
Contact me for custom work - Expert GS developer with 15 years of GS experience - Skype: armelline.support
Nice
1 million funding ... again ... I sure hope its used better than the last batch of funding.
Over the 5 or so years i've been around, I see a yellow poster, gets a little active, promises this and that and then disappears.
Said guy now moves on.
Forums take a dive.
New yellow poster comes along.
Repeat process.
Yellow poster now tells of this new direction the company are heading in.
GS puts all resources into this.
GS pulls the plug on said project.
GameSalad creator remains the product that actually has this as a business, yet time and time again, mismanagement fails to focus solely on providing the product that this should now be after all these years!
Hardly open up GS these days, hardly come here these days ... Sad times!
At first it sounds great but....
It concerns me that GS NEEDS 1 Million in external funding. Can't make GS profitable?
That million will get chewed up quickly.
Rule 1,2 and 3 of business! Use any given external funds before the internal funds.
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I say let's start a kickstarter campaign for every feature request, who's with me?
Boosting me to Trust Gamesalad and continue on my business(Making Apps with Gamesalad and completely depend on Gamesalad) to live.
Thanks
still waiting for .exe export for pc.
OPM, baby. Other People's Money.
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I trust that the team is hard at work making GS a stronger and more stable tool. However, my biggest issue is the horrible lack of advanced features.
We have waited and waited and waited for things like custom fonts, joints, polygon collision etc. And it seems we are no closer to having these things now than we were a year ago. I wouldn't be surprised if it was another year before any of these features were implemented in a stable form.
If GS just had custom fonts right now, I would be perfectly happy sticking with it. It is incredibly painful and time consuming to even make something as simple as a screen to display a list of stats without it looking horrible by using Display Text. I am so tired of not being able to do this easily. Frankly I don't understand how anybody can think ANY of the features we've been waiting for are more important than this. You can make a fine game without joints or polygon collision easily enough, but without custom fonts it is really difficult to make a professional looking game.
Another thing that worries me is the whole Gamesalad/Graphene relationship. It makes no sense to me to put all this effort into Gamesalad when Graphene is going to have all of it and more. Of course, we do need Gamesalad to be in a truly stable state so that people can continue to use it while Graphene is in the works. However, once that stable state is reached, they should forget about implementing the bigger features as it will only slow down Graphene development. Once Graphene is available, nobody in their right mind would continue to use Gamesalad for anything other than updating the games they already made with it. Thus the extra features would be mostly wasted in Gamesalad. I don't see how the team is ever going to have the resources to support two different programs and I don't see why they would.
I simply can't afford to wait around much longer, which is why I'm on the verge of switching to Stencyl.
Sadly, the GameSalad folks have made ALOT of rookie mistakes and don't seem to have a good finger on the pulse of the industry.
I don't doubt their technical expertise - GameSalad is a great product with LOTS of potential - but their business sense is... well... let's say they have PLENTY of room for improvement.
Sadly, it actually takes good business sense to realize you have no business sense - kind of a catch 22 situation. But once you realize that, you can outsource the business and marketing side to someone who is more experienced.
I know from running MULTIPLE businesses that you can't do it all yourself. Or at least, you can't do it all yourself very well.
My advice:
1) Outsource/hire to fill in the gaps - business and marketing. Let's face it, you either suck or are too busy to do them properly (no offense, it happens to the best of us)
2) Focus on your customers - you may have just gotten a hit of external cash, but in the long term, if you don't build and cultivate good relations with the MAJORITY of your customer base (not just your fanboi's), you're going down for the count...
3) LONGER free trial - this goes to the marketing thing. You don't have a large enough base and you aren't popular enough to be pushing away perspective customers. Give them an unlimited (or at least 30 days) free trial, but don't let them publish. In the long run, you're going to make more money from having more people use it and 15 days just isn't enough.
4) Communication - Look at the vast majority of the responses in this thread and most of them just want some communication. You know why? Because it makes them feel like they are involved and that you care about them. I'm sure you DO care about them, but if you aren't doing the things that show it, they won't know it. I have 2 ex-wives who will attest to that fact.
So, I'm off my soapbox and done giving unsolicited advice.
1) hire?
They just laid off a bunch of people
2)focus on customers?
They are working on getting NEW customers. New cash. They already have your cash.
3)longer free trial?
Agree. One month.
4)communication? It's been much better overall so when it's a little quiet we freak out.
but with the new system they need to keep your cash. if they don't deliver you can walk away and stop paying
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GS has the retention numbers.
People who pay stay.
We complain but don't leave.
Either it's Techincally impossible to add and improve UI but my guess it's cost prohibitive.
Like the snap to grid feature thread. It's probably a 20,000 $ cost to implement.
Makes no ecenomic sense to do it. Will add no revenue.
I love GS. I'm realistic. It's all about money.
There is a distinct lake of marketing at GS. But I suppose it is hard to market a beta version of anything so maybe the recent spate of activity is aimed at getting v1.0 out the door (I hope). When they have that they can really start to market it and generate sales so they don't need injections of capital which imagine will eventually dry up. I mean who is going to keep shovelling money into a black hole eventually the investors will want a return. But hey maybe Amazon or some other company will keep doing it for reasons I don't understand.
They could then develop partner and reseller programs for other business driving more sales. I believe this is on hold at the moment or yet to be done.
The education program would be another great way to organically grow sales. Once members get accreditation they can run courses in their local area which would bring in a lot of new members from all around the world. I enquired about this a couple of weeks ago and was told it too is on hold for now.
Where is the video (Or at least a link) on the Home page showing me how easy it is to make a game using GameSalad and a bunch of other stuff? I found it, a link that is, but it wasn't easy. It should be in your face so you can't help but click it. The link took me to a page which has everything I need to know before I buy five stars to GS for that, zero stars for being obvious/well thought out. What the hell is a Crouton? I thought it was something you put in a Waldorf salad apparently it is also an art pack. When it is called an art pack I know what it is because it says what it is. I think GS is trying to be too clever and will just confuse a lot of people and make them feel like idiots for not figuring it out straight away.
They should also consider a multiple year subscription like three years for the price of two or five years for the price of three. It is always better to get a chunk of cash up front because a lot of users come and go in a short space of time. I imagine it would depend on the drop out rate if it is high this would be a good option.
A 1m cash injection after downsizing and putting Graphine on hold doesn't instil any confidence in me, it seems more like putting off the inevitable. However if in the near future I see a big flashy online marketing campaign with a lot of fanfare spooking the imminent release of v1.whatever I might then have confidence that GS is here for the long run and think part of that 1m was well spent.
GS has a great product, far superior to anything else out there that I can find that doesn't require coding. It desperately needs the services of a professional marketer who can reach out to new users and communicate the benefits of Creator in a way that excites them and shows them how easy it is to make a game using Creator.
COME ON GS start marketing your product!! I need you to stick around.
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Good to hear.
Lol!
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This is the best news.
Well, OK , after reading through the entire post, I remain optimistic that GameSalad will be around for a while and will improve. I would also second what @gingagaming said ....that to be responsible for ones own well being/livelihood, if making apps is how you support yourself, than learning another SDK is probably a good idea.
FWIW I suspect that the following is happening (speculation!) and I think it's important people understand.
I think new funds have come in, to enable a reset of the business around more obtainable goals while shedding some of the pressure to generate returns that may have seemed plausible at the outset of GameSalad and the original mobile app store gold rush.
I suspect My sense, and my belief is GameSalad is actually a decent business if they can keep having the support of developers like us. Good. It needs to be first-and-foremost a business that thrives as a tool business vs. other ideas like capturing a percentage of eCPM, etc.
Things have seemed more organized for a while, with the exception of recent posts from @CodeWizard that were important communications. I suspect there what happened, given his recent post, is he has been consumed by the process of securing not only the funding but an entire reset of the shareholder cap-table and business plan. Again a bit of speculation, but as someone who has helped folks raise money, this stuff is way more stressful and all-consuming than you can imagine.
I suspect that aside from the biz model reset of GameSalad Creator itself, we will see additional new revenue lines start to formulate once things settle down a bit and priorities are reset. The off-loading of the store, etc. to a partnership is a good sign that @CodeWizard is going to hyper-focus on the tool with the resources they have remaining and now-achieved.
The recent pricing shift I think represents a tough, but important choice. GameSalad needs to figure out how to better monetize what it has in place with its pro-to-hobbyist community. If it can be successful, however retrenched, with this plan, then it can work from a place of strength, rather, than the other way around which I suspect was always a plan that downplayed the value of GameSalad as a traditional tool developer and more as something that would generate revenue heavily from the output of the tool and the community in the flourishing app store marketplace.
I think the shift we're seeing is turning the original plan on its head. GameSalad will be a set of pay-for tools & services first, and then look at other upside businesses second, albeit eventually more aggressively as/if the overall situation and new investor plan takes hold well.
I'm heartened by the news of more funding, but not because of the funding itself, but because I think it's part of an overall effort that's been going on for a while toward an increase in rationality for the business itself. Many companies that are founded under economic landscapes that shift, don't often get to make such a reset.
If I'm right, even 60% consider us all a bit lucky, and give your best to the team still in-place because the seem to be fighting like hell to keep this all going.
A great thread... discusses issues that are probably high on many GS users agendas. The GS team probably don't like to see threads like this, but it helps them to see and understand the thoughts and concerns of many of their long time supporters.
Im surprised to see it coming from the ex-Guru, but totally understandable as he's often backed GS to the hilt, only to get burnt when the announce another U-turn. So when your biggest supporters are showing concern, its good to hear them out....
Im one of GS biggest supporters... although I often show it in a different way. Im very vocal about its failings and where it should really be improved. Very vocal about the awful changes in directions, and the mismanagement of assets. Ive always argued that the core engine and tool should always have been the priority, and still should be...
This is probably the third or fourth time in five years that Ive had to seriously consider my ongoing use of GameSalad... whether in a years time, the software is still going to be around to finish games Im starting now.... and to be honest, for the third or fourth time...Im not 100% convinced.
Financially... the new monthly payment system makes it easier to chew... as Im not at risk of losing a chunk of money, but thats not really the issue. The issue is one of trust. Its wanting to feel safe that if I start a new game now, that might take a year or more to develop, that its not going to be left in limbo 80% through, if GS finally kicks the bucket and closes up shop.
All the politics, changes in direction, staff layoffs, broken promises and slow development progression on engine and toolset improvements just fight against building trust, and give GameSalad a pretty negative reputation in the game dev industry... one that to be honest... is justified.
And this is where GS really need to turn things around if they are to survive, and prosper in the future. A solid, usable tool, that can be trusted, and that real game dev professionals would consider using... that then drives further reputation, and trust. They need to help developers build good games, that really show off the capabilities of the tool, rather than constantly pushing how easy it is to knock out shovel ware apps in a matter of hours or days. The software needs to start pushing out quality best sellers, that best promote the engine and tools.
Ive decided to carry on using GameSalad... at least to finish off my current batch of games... which will probably take me into early next year, but I do have that concern at the bottom of my gut, every time Im using the software, that any day, progress on my games could be stopped dead in their tracks....
More long term... I don't like having that feeling, and Im still not convinced... so I do look at, and consider switching new and future development to other engines.
Theres also the issue of GameSalads lack of viability when considering it as a tool to use, for industry job prospects. You never see any jobs advertised looking for GS developers/designers... the company has always leaned more towards the hobbyist label, and just carries no weight or realistic consideration in the games industry. Which has always been a big fail, as its where the serious subscription fees are... and limits the softwares scalability and use.
I really hope to see them take things in the right direction, as at its heart, theres an amazingly good game engine and development environment. Its just been mismanaged and not improved in the right areas. But theres still hope....
So again... After 5 years I have a lot of time invested that I don't want to throw away, and i still have games in mid development using GS...so Im along for the ride, and waiting to see what promises actually become reality this time around. But this time could well be the last....
But yup... good to see other peoples concerns, and it being discussed...
I don't suspect many over at the mothership realize that history. Franky as I was going to let it go past but I have to say I was a bit taken aback by,
No one was speculating what anyone was doing, we were wondering about the viability of the product we purchase on an on going basis. I could have a few choice words here but I'm trying desperately here to take the high road for once. (no one is better at being an Ahole than me, I've had lots of practice trust me, hey it's gift what can I say).
Here are the facts as, @socks pointed out, this company had a major shake up in public which included revenue changes, what else can an outsider do but wonder if they may possibly wasting their time? I didn't think it was unreasonable for me a longtime PAYING customer to ask for some simple reassurances before I invest my time and more money aka hiring artists et... If that's unreasonable then I don't know what to think. Okay back to working on my multiplayer game. See I have confidence now and I will in short order be delivering the first multiplayer game using Playtogether. Oh and BTW I'm taking that on faith as this feature is not even in current builds and oh GS bought Playtogether Hmmm you think me showing their multiplayer works might inspire confidence and revenue for their acquisition? Shoot what do I know, I'm just some Ahole >:)
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@Chunkypixels said...All the politics, changes in direction, staff layoffs, broken promises and slow development progression on engine and toolset improvements just fight against building trust, and give GameSalad a pretty negative reputation in the game dev industry... one that to be honest... is justified.
They guy who suggested I try GS said this exact thing to me 2 years ago. "They have a bad rep in the dev community". I didn't understand why at the time. It's very clear to me now why they COULD have a bad rep...I don't have a lot to back up my claim but if the dev community heard the news GS had a bug free final version with a non beta release people would flock to GS for at least a little while.
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@Thunder_Child ...to be fair, what I should have said was: "give GameSalad a pretty negative reputation in the game dev industry... if the devs have even heard of it."
Ive worked in the games industry for close to 30 years now, primarily as an artist... so know, meet or work with a lot of coders and developers. When I mention Im developing a game with GameSalad, they often just give me a blank look... and ask "whats GameSalad?... why aren't you using Unity?"
If I have time, and GameSalad available, I'll show them... to which they're normally initially quite surprised at what its capable of.... but then when I mention things like many of the bugs, or long-time missing or incomplete features, or the biggie of having to compile builds via an online server... they quickly lose all interest. (Seems the online compiling of builds and the lack of access to code is the single biggest negative when speaking to professional developers/studios/publishers.. which is understandable)
If the other person does actually have some prior knowledge of GameSalad, its normally not positive... along the lines of... "I hear bad things about it".
Ive even had a couple of fully finished games all but sold to publishers, only to be rejected at the final hurdles, due to them being developed in GameSalad.
So yup... it misses out on a massive portion of the Game Development Industry... which is such a huge shame... both for the professional image and reputation of the software, and for its missing out on potentially lucrative subscriptions.