Which of these would you consider a game developer.

The_Gamesalad_GuruThe_Gamesalad_Guru Member Posts: 9,914
This is meant in reference to the individual or partnership developers. Not in defining large companies.
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Comments

  • IsabelleKIsabelleK Member, Sous Chef Posts: 2,807
    I think that the most important thing is the game design, plus something more - code, art, or sound.
  • jonmulcahyjonmulcahy Member, Sous Chef, PRO Posts: 10,385
    Yea, to me the developer is the person who puts everything together / codes the game. The art would come from an artist and the sound from a musician.

    Ideas are like opinions :)
  • The_Gamesalad_GuruThe_Gamesalad_Guru Member Posts: 9,914
    edited May 2012
    I guess I'm one of the few who can do all of it although I do work with artists more talented than me (shameless plug for @RP) but for me it should be your original idea which would include a new take on something and coding.
  • IsabelleKIsabelleK Member, Sous Chef Posts: 2,807
    edited May 2012
    I guess I'm one of the few who can do all of it although I do work with artists more talented than me (shameless plug for @RP)
    So the question was "what are you able to do", or "what does game developer must do, at minimum, to be considered as a game developer"? :P
  • rhinokeyrhinokey Member Posts: 158
    edited May 2012
    i've been making games for 10 years moslty AAA mmos, and in the game industry anyone involved in creating assets is a developer, developers are broke down into chunks, design, who has the ideas and some times implement them, artists who do the art, sound engineers, coders, they are all developers. Q.A and testing are sometimes not considered development staff, sometimes are, depending on the studio. Where i work now they are.
  • The_Gamesalad_GuruThe_Gamesalad_Guru Member Posts: 9,914
    edited May 2012
    Didn't mean to confuse the topic with my shameless comment.....LOL
  • DimensionGamesDimensionGames PRO Posts: 993
    I voted for the wrong one :'( I basically agree with @jonmulcahy on what constitutes a game developer.
  • CluvCluv Member Posts: 229
    I have a friend who is a software engineer for a large printer company and his whole attitude is that if someone else has done it and done it better, and he has access to the code, then he should use it. He thinks all software engineers are lazy and should be, because one shouldn't try and reinvent the wheel. I don't know if I agree with that statement, but it is just a thought.
  • MotherHooseMotherHoose Member Posts: 2,456
    edited May 2012
    well … if I voted it would have been: "Someone who does it all"

    but I would mean:
    someone who had the idea
    -- using all their own ideas or with elements from others
    someone who designed the graphic GUI
    -- using their artwork or others
    someone who designed the audio ambiance
    -- using their own SFX and music or others
    someone who coded all the playFlow
    -- using their own code or snippets/chunks from others

    to me, developing is putting all the pieces together and making them work!

    using gameEngines (even Xcode is an app developer's engine) … allows us to develop a game/app … then compiles our work … thus none of us does it all

    we fly with the help from our colleagues … and sometimes we soar!

    image MH
  • The_Gamesalad_GuruThe_Gamesalad_Guru Member Posts: 9,914
    I guess what I'm trying to get my head around is kinda like this...John Mayer didn't invent the guitar, language or musical scales but he is a singer, songwriter and musician defining his craft. Those who don't write songs or play instruments are called producers. There is a defining of the art from the mechanics. Also I specifically stated I wasn't talking about the inherent nature of large creative companies as I know how those work and the process of creativity is much different as people specialize which is not true at this level of creation.
  • CluvCluv Member Posts: 229
    As an artist and musician, I believe that most art is derivative in some fashion. We normally take to heart what we like, and discard what we don't. When someone "comes up" with a game idea, song idea, what-have-you, they are synthesizing a bunch of other people's ideas in a way that they see as novel. This is still creativity, in my opinion, and should be attributed to the person who puts it all together, especially if the end product has something novel to offer.

    I think you have to look at GS as like GarageBand or something. So, here is a question: If a person who uses a bunch of set garageband loops on top of each other and uploads it on to the internet, did they make a song? Is he/she a songwriter? So, if a person takes a few templates and sticks them together, are they a game developer? I think it all depends on what the ultimate goal of the piece is, and, whether or not anything novel was achieved.

    "Super Meat Boy," for example, is totally derivative in its approach and play-style. Heck, they are even proud of flaunting the ways in which they "borrow" from other games in the art and music. One could argue they coded it themselves, but if they hadn't, would it make a lick of difference?
  • bazookaBenbazookaBen Member Posts: 318
    it has to be someone who actually ships a game
  • PhiliePhilie PRO Posts: 240
    Yea, to me the developer is the person who puts everything together / codes the game. The art would come from an artist and the sound from a musician.

    Ideas are like opinions :)
    I agree completely, who cares if you paid an artist to make the graphics, and a musician to do the music. If you had the idea, and took it from that to a fully complete game on the App Store, etc, then you are a game developer.
  • tatiangtatiang Member, Sous Chef, PRO, Senior Sous-Chef Posts: 11,925
    The person who designed the game idea, algorithms, etc., and also coded it. But I'm biased because my skills as an artist and musician are quite limited!

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  • LeonardDeveloperLeonardDeveloper Member Posts: 4,630
    Its Deffinately; Someone who designed the game and created one of the following..art, sound or code?

    I don't know who would vote: Someone who assembled the game with others art, sound, and code but the idea was theirs?

    Anyone can come up with ideas; Developing means "Creating" "Putting together" "Stitching the threads" "Cementing the blocks" not; Thnking of ways to glue the blocks together..
  • EbreezeEbreeze Member, PRO Posts: 481
    What does it matter? Thats whats great about GS and other visual programming tools. Let's face it this is the future and that's awesome...no more painful coding in obj c or java script..I can make a game fast and cheap, with a template or without...
  • The_Gamesalad_GuruThe_Gamesalad_Guru Member Posts: 9,914
    edited May 2012
    @ebreeze I guess you don't enjoy philosophical discussions. This is what artists do, they explore the undefined and try to express it with words or some other visual or audio medium. This is kinda my point, does the prefabricated nature of templates, sprites and such dilute the process when all are not created but merely assembled by someone. I think many come with high hopes only to find unoriginality is not usually rewarded in the consumer market. I can also see trying to raise the depth of the forum is kinda pointless.
  • monkeysaladmonkeysalad Member Posts: 16
    All of the above.
  • EatingMyHatEatingMyHat Member Posts: 1,246
    edited May 2012
    * Designer - someone who designs (levels, story, art guidelines, etc.)
    * Developer - someone who writes code
    * Graphic Artist - create art
    * Composer - create music
    * Publisher - publish games to the market

    You can do one piece or all... but if you are not writing code (or GS in this case) you are not a developer. What used to be called Game Development companies is now called Game Studios, the reason is that the phrase 'Development' does not capture everything that is involved in the Game Creation process.

  • monkeysaladmonkeysalad Member Posts: 16
    @eatingmyhat, I disagree. I believe if you participate meaningfully in the development of a game, you are a "game developer." A designer is just as important to the development process as a coder - saying one is a "developer" and the other isn't seems completely arbitrary. In the Game Development field (yep, that's what it is called) Designers ofter write code, artists often use design/code tools to implement art, coders contribute to design, and so on.
  • EatingMyHatEatingMyHat Member Posts: 1,246
    @monkeysalad You are coming out from the assumption that the Developer is the top of the pyramid in the creation process and everybody wants to be one... this is far from the truth. I have not met a game designer, artist or composer that wanted to be called a developer or that will answer a 'developer' wanted ad (I actually did met a publisher that called himself a developer...).

    True, they are all in the game development field and they participate in the development process. But my QA teams, documentation and product managers also participate in the development process, but you will not consider calling them developers, right?
  • The_Gamesalad_GuruThe_Gamesalad_Guru Member Posts: 9,914
    Now we're getting to the meat of this discussion. I think publisher defines the first and second pole questions.
  • EatingMyHatEatingMyHat Member Posts: 1,246
    @FryingBaconStudios Published only publish the game, it does not do any art, code or sound. As an example Activation publishes Call of Duty using Infinity Ward (and others) as their development studios.
  • allornothingallornothing Member, PRO Posts: 126
    Anyone who produces content specifically for a game is a game developer, regardless of the skillset.

    To say that an artist isn't a game developer, despite having to work with workflows and game dev pipelines/engine tech, is basically an insult to game dev artists. Some game 'designers' don't actually produce any content in the final game (it's scripting, content design) yet they are still developers.

    I don't think this is a very nice question really.
  • allornothingallornothing Member, PRO Posts: 126
    I'd also like to add that Game Developer ≠ Writes Code. Someone who writes code is a Programmer or Coder. A developer (even by dictionary definition) is someone who develops something - someone who makes something, in this case, for a game.
  • EbreezeEbreeze Member, PRO Posts: 481
    Anyone who produces content specifically for a game is a game developer, regardless of the skillset.

    To say that an artist isn't a game developer, despite having to work with workflows and game dev pipelines/engine tech, is basically an insult to game dev artists. Some game 'designers' don't actually produce any content in the final game (it's scripting, content design) yet they are still developers.

    I don't think this is a very nice question really.
    Agreed , these questions are a bit condescending towards some GS members

  • xforcexforce Member Posts: 187
    my actual interpretation of a game developer is simply someone who makes video games and receives money for doing so
  • monkeysaladmonkeysalad Member Posts: 16

    True, they are all in the game development field and they participate in the development process. But my QA teams, documentation and product managers also participate in the development process, but you will not consider calling them developers, right?
    Your thinking that I'm assuming Developer is the "top of the pyramid" actually reveals more about where you're coming from than it does about my post. What I said is that Developer is a term that encompasses the whole pyramid, if we have to use a pyramid analogy. That's why "game development" is the term used for the game creation industry - if you are creating something used in a game, you are involved in the development of that game, and are therefore a "developer."

    You bring up some interesting questions - are QA "developers?" I would say no, because they aren't directly involved with creating or even changing the game, only with identifying and reporting areas that aren't working correctly.
  • The_Gamesalad_GuruThe_Gamesalad_Guru Member Posts: 9,914
    edited May 2012
    I say this in all seriousness. Can anyone around here handle an adult discussion without being offended? Do that many of you lack That much confidence and/or self esteem to be offended by a philosophical question? I myself am tired of being censored for fear someone will misinterpret what I might say or be offended with a question not directed at anyone or ones specifically. To work on the pretense you can somehow read between the line is a fantasy in your own mind so please don't project your reality onto me.
  • EatingMyHatEatingMyHat Member Posts: 1,246
    @FryingBaconStudios Someone got offended?
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