lexander said: The existence of SpriteDeck is predictable, but it's far from a GameSalad. Corona knows that they lack any good tools for non-programmers. Until then, they are not exactly "for everyone".
I think it is a fallacy to think that Corona+SpriteDeck will ever collide. We are not trying to be Corona, but they are certainly envious of us.
Wow, those are bold words. Is it confidence or arrogance? It seems you're not worried, but Corona's aggressive or "envious" nature is something I see as a threat to GameSalad. If they know that a friendly editor is the main competitive edge of GameSalad, what's to stop them from adding their own? True, SpriteDeck is far from GameSalad. But if some entrepreneurial member of the community could get that far, what's to stop Corona from taking it further?
lexander said: We believe that it is good designers that make great games.
That explanation is interesting. I think I better understand what I do - I'm a designer. It's probably why I hesitate to use Corona. It's not a design tool. I can program, but it is a different type of thinking.
lexander said: Starting from an engine and adding lua scripting is evolutionary. It's been done, but has never become mainstream.
...but GameSalad uses Lua. While what you're doing is rare, how is it not easily reproduced? Is the interface patented?
I was thinking on how to make GameSalad better. I was thinking that it could easily be recreated in HTML / AJAX. Ultimately, a GameSalad project is just a bunch of content and XML files. There's a lot of stuff that happens on the GameSalad server, but I don't think it's impossible to reverse engineer what's going on.
lexander said: It's also not very glamorous making a difficult task, accessible and fast for people who don't like to code, but we love it.
Actually, what I think GameSalad is doing is glamorous. It's future-thinking. It's how Apple got cool. Something complicated was made simple and sexy. GameSalad does that for game development.
My concern is the angry mob at the castle gates. Jealousy, rage, envy, frustration, anger... that seems surprising for such fun software. How did GameSalad community become so similar to an MMORPG community? HA!
PAUSE GOT NERFED!
Update 0.9.1... pause returns
PAUSE OVERPOWERED!
tenrdrmerMember, Sous Chef, Senior Sous-ChefPosts: 9,934
lexander said: I think it is a fallacy to think that Corona+SpriteDeck will ever collide. We are not trying to be Corona, but they are certainly envious of us.
I have to dis agree with you. While it is not a full drag n drop GUI it makes Corona look far mare appealing to non coders, because it gives you a starting point to learn from. It's very over whelming to start from scratch with coding believe me anytime I try I never finish.
I still have no interest ing jumping ship but I think it is very arrogant to not see this as a threat to GameSalad. It just got much easier for a "designer" to build a game with Corona SDK so the good designers are more likely to start jumping ship. and GameSalad is going to find it self left with the few of us who have thrown ourselves behind GameSalad 100% and a bunch of other who have no clue and just submitting crap and stealing templates.
Again I know it's no replacement for GameSalad for everyone but it very well could be for the guys you don't want to lose. You've already lost Fire Maple Games and now his coding time will be cut even more with sprite deck. not reason to come back so he can have less feature and performance. How much longer do you think you will hang onto the likes of Tshirtbooth or Utopian Games if things don't change here. They are both die hard GameSaladers but everyone has a limit.
Don't forget. Apple rescinded their block on Adobe a while back, and now Adobe is going to release Creative Suite 5.5 Digital Publishing very soon, and that's going to target iOS development in a big way.
No doubt we'll see a flood of Flash-based games coming out of the woodworks as soon as this is released.
I really really really really really wanted GameSalad to slam on the accelerator (no pun intended) and get much needed features implemented, and quickly!
I literally have a game done and I'm waiting on GameSalad... I REALLY don't wanna go learn how to code but the features are so appealing.
tenrdrmerMember, Sous Chef, Senior Sous-ChefPosts: 9,934
I actually have a couple awesome game ideas but i'm rushed on them at the moment because the drive to continue to play would be so much higher if it ha game center just for global leader boards. It would be tons of fun.
P.S. With the iPhone coming to Verizon soon I would like to get my game out ASAP with the same kinda features I could get on Corona (OpenFeint, Facebook, you know the deal). I don't know how other people feel but maybe that's just me.
tenrdrmer said: I actually have a couple awesome game ideas but i'm rushed on them at the moment because the drive to continue to play would be so much higher if it ha game center just for global leader boards. It would be tons of fun.
Yeah it seems like the problem here is that GS wants to focus on being EASY as opposed to being LEGIT AS BALLS and other engines are the opposite. GS attracts the Average Joe which is great and all but for people who want to make serious games it just lacks (for the most part).
BeyondtheTech said: No doubt we'll see a flood of Flash-based games coming out of the woodworks as soon as this is released.
I'm not too impressed with what Adobe has done with Flash and iPhone development. I think GameSalad is more of a threat to Adobe than Flash is to GameSalad.
My opinion hasn't changed much... and that was before Flash got kicked out of (and then returned to) the app store. Basically, Adobe wants a lot of money for their software. I'm starting to doubt if it's worth it. I think there's room for competition. Maybe not a complete and immediate replacement for Adobe products, but certainly alternatives. For iOS game development I think GameSalad is currently a better alternative to Flash.
Future competition between Flash and GameSalad depends on the development of the GameSalad web plugin. I've been phasing out Flash from my website and I haven't found a suitable replacement yet. With the web moving towards mobile devices - that have apps - the ubiquity of Flash has been mitigated. I haven't been that impressed with the performance of Flash on anything other than a desktop...
PlayStation 3, Wii, Android... it's just not as good. On iOS, the browser doesn't support Flash. So, if I have to create apps separate from web content, it creates an opportunity for new software.
zeeyang said: GameSalad users, please use this coupon and get 50% off on SpriteDeck. This coupon is valid until Feb 6, so please take your time to evaluate.
Coupon: ***********
lol i thought it was a joke but it works, spritedeck for 25 bucks nice
zeeyang said: GameSalad users, please use this coupon and get 50% off on SpriteDeck. This coupon is valid until Feb 6, so please take your time to evaluate.
Coupon: ***********
This is the kind of bullshit I dislike about Corona, and one of the things that puts me right off it.
cbowers428 said: Hey, if you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen.
Again, I call bullshit.
I don't see Darren and Wayne popping over to the Corona forums to sell their GameSalad stuff. And they probably wouldn't use 'MOREBEER' as a coupon code.
lexander said: We believe that it is good designers that make great games. What matters is that tools have to be ACCESSIBLE to designers. 99% don't have Computer Science degree, let alone a programming background.
Starting from an engine and adding lua scripting is evolutionary. It's been done, but has never become mainstream. Creating a tool designed for Designers is a revolutionary endevour. Programmers normally don't think about starting with the workflow around designers and developing from there. It's also not very glamorous making a difficult task, accessible and fast for people who don't like to code, but we love it.
If you mean 'Game Designers', a lot of those are required to know lua. Therefore, Corona would seem a better bet for them.
I don't see Darren and Wayne popping over to the Corona forums to sell their GameSalad stuff. And they probably wouldn't use 'MOREBEER' as a coupon code.
QS
Look, I'm on the GS forums, I use GS, and I appreciate the program because its ease of use. However, I think we all know that when it comes down to features Corona is better. It's just not friendly for people who can't code. When GS steps it up and we get GameCenter, Facebook, etc. we can all just run over to the Corona forums with our guns blazin and stage a takeover lol
cbowers428 said: Look, I'm on the GS forums, I use GS, and I appreciate the program because its ease of use. However, I think we all know that when it comes down to features Corona is better. It's just not friendly for people who can't code. When GS steps it up and we get GameCenter, Facebook, etc. we can all just run over to the Corona forums with our guns blazin and stage a takeover lol
I agree with what you're saying, up to the last part.
People, you can't compare GS to Corona. GS requires NO CODE, whereas Corona still requires code. I don't think you need an in depth analysis of the two.
I'm sticking with GS, and like QS, will be way too busy enjoying new features to even care about trolling the Corona forums.
I am using both. Some of my new games will not require OF/FB, but the ones I'm redesigning will benefit out of those features right now. I said before, I mainly make taptards, now I'll make taptards with leaderboards xD So until GS don't implement them, I'll keep at it over there.
Spritedeck or gumbo (free) do still require coding and none even come close to what GS can do, but it does help layout a lot easier than GS can; that's something I wish GS can look into.
Once GS incorporates those new features, a lot of people will come back, I'm sure (and I haven't left, just day job is taking more priority)...my only concern is stability on both tool and device in regards to performance; I don't think they're far away...but it seems like there's a big gap between 0.9.0 and 1.0.
I'm using SpriteDeck for Corona just messing around and the good thing I must give them props for is their customer service. I had a question and I spoke to lead dev in less than 5 minutes and literally sent him my game file and he fixed it and told me what's wrong. Also they always listen to what people want and have been updating recently. I see them heading in the right direction but they said themselves they don't want to be like GameSalad and instead aim towards more advanced users. I don't see that mindset holding up for long and they prob could threaten GameSalad in coming months at the rate at which they try and improve things. I'm still cheering for GS though (since I already use it) and I just hope they get the show on the road fast (especially with the iPhone coming to Verizon soon).
Comments
I was thinking on how to make GameSalad better. I was thinking that it could easily be recreated in HTML / AJAX. Ultimately, a GameSalad project is just a bunch of content and XML files. There's a lot of stuff that happens on the GameSalad server, but I don't think it's impossible to reverse engineer what's going on. Actually, what I think GameSalad is doing is glamorous. It's future-thinking. It's how Apple got cool. Something complicated was made simple and sexy. GameSalad does that for game development.
My concern is the angry mob at the castle gates. Jealousy, rage, envy, frustration, anger... that seems surprising for such fun software. How did GameSalad community become so similar to an MMORPG community? HA!
PAUSE GOT NERFED!
Update 0.9.1... pause returns
PAUSE OVERPOWERED!
I still have no interest ing jumping ship but I think it is very arrogant to not see this as a threat to GameSalad. It just got much easier for a "designer" to build a game with Corona SDK so the good designers are more likely to start jumping ship. and GameSalad is going to find it self left with the few of us who have thrown ourselves behind GameSalad 100% and a bunch of other who have no clue and just submitting crap and stealing templates.
Again I know it's no replacement for GameSalad for everyone but it very well could be for the guys you don't want to lose. You've already lost Fire Maple Games and now his coding time will be cut even more with sprite deck. not reason to come back so he can have less feature and performance. How much longer do you think you will hang onto the likes of Tshirtbooth or Utopian Games if things don't change here. They are both die hard GameSaladers but everyone has a limit.
http://macdailynews.com/index.php/weblog/comments/28441/
No doubt we'll see a flood of Flash-based games coming out of the woodworks as soon as this is released.
I really really really really really wanted GameSalad to slam on the accelerator (no pun intended) and get much needed features implemented, and quickly!
I wrote an article about this almost a year ago...
http://photics.com/the-future-of-flash-looks-bad
My opinion hasn't changed much... and that was before Flash got kicked out of (and then returned to) the app store. Basically, Adobe wants a lot of money for their software. I'm starting to doubt if it's worth it. I think there's room for competition. Maybe not a complete and immediate replacement for Adobe products, but certainly alternatives. For iOS game development I think GameSalad is currently a better alternative to Flash.
Future competition between Flash and GameSalad depends on the development of the GameSalad web plugin. I've been phasing out Flash from my website and I haven't found a suitable replacement yet. With the web moving towards mobile devices - that have apps - the ubiquity of Flash has been mitigated. I haven't been that impressed with the performance of Flash on anything other than a desktop...
PlayStation 3, Wii, Android... it's just not as good. On iOS, the browser doesn't support Flash. So, if I have to create apps separate from web content, it creates an opportunity for new software.
Coupon: MORESALAD
Well done!
QS
Dr. Sam Beckett never returned home...
Twitter: https://twitter.com/Quantum_Sheep
Web: https://quantumsheep.itch.io
It would be a dream to save a finished version right on our desktop and upload to apple without the tedious publish procedure we have to do now ....
Boy that's a professional way to run a business!
-- Yodapollo
EDIT: removed the coupon code reference.
I don't see Darren and Wayne popping over to the Corona forums to sell their GameSalad stuff. And they probably wouldn't use 'MOREBEER' as a coupon code.
QS
Dr. Sam Beckett never returned home...
Twitter: https://twitter.com/Quantum_Sheep
Web: https://quantumsheep.itch.io
If you mean 'Graphic Designers' - then fair play.
QS
Dr. Sam Beckett never returned home...
Twitter: https://twitter.com/Quantum_Sheep
Web: https://quantumsheep.itch.io
I'll be too busy using the shiny new features
QS
Dr. Sam Beckett never returned home...
Twitter: https://twitter.com/Quantum_Sheep
Web: https://quantumsheep.itch.io
I'm sticking with GS, and like QS, will be way too busy enjoying new features to even care about trolling the Corona forums.
You can't compare GS to Corona.
I am using both. Some of my new games will not require OF/FB, but the ones I'm redesigning will benefit out of those features right now.
I said before, I mainly make taptards, now I'll make taptards with leaderboards xD
So until GS don't implement them, I'll keep at it over there.
Spritedeck or gumbo (free) do still require coding and none even come close to what GS can do, but it does help layout a lot easier than GS can; that's something I wish GS can look into.
Once GS incorporates those new features, a lot of people will come back, I'm sure (and I haven't left, just day job is taking more priority)...my only concern is stability on both tool and device in regards to performance; I don't think they're far away...but it seems like there's a big gap between 0.9.0 and 1.0.
Cheers
RD