icanmake said: i love the idea. i am going to be starting a religious game soon. i announced it a few weeks ago called paper crusaders. Good luck with the app and God Bless =D
I appreciate your support! God Bless you too.
Ultima, I also appreciate your support! The main goal of this app (and thread) is to get people to christ and to read to bible and learn about god. The goal of this app is not to make money or become popular. I say that god has already made this successful being that this thread is getting many people commenting on it and already has a second page.
I am not a Sous chef but I would like to let you know I do not appreciate religions being spread on this forum. Neither politics for that matter. I do understand your question is wether your app is a good idea and I respect that. Leave it with that please.
If it was well made I'm sure it could get some downloads because of general curiosity, though I'm not really sure what you would fill it with as the Bible doesn't really deal in facts.
Are you the same guy who was making the Crusades game?
I think it would be a great app. I agree with the sentiment being expressed about making sure it is well made. My advise would be to include lots of scientific facts. http://www.answersingenesis.org/ would be a great resource for this.
keweworkshop said: I think it would be a great app. I agree with the sentiment being expressed about making sure it is well made. My advise would be to include lots of scientific facts. http://www.answersingenesis.org/ would be a great resource for this.
MY GOD!!! (excuse me)
That site is absolutely shocking. It's like someone actually setting out to knock down public knowledge and information and replace it with absolute nonsensical crap. I guess that's what they want, return public understanding to the level of the middle ages, when ignorance helped keep religions going. I'm all for free speech but there is not one single evidence based scientific fact given by those idiots (sorry, they use origin based science instead which kinda suggests you can just make up anything you like as long as you can find a bible passage to go with it).
quantumsheep said: Will the app just be a blank screen?
On a more serious note, I think you'd do best to make this free as you'll reach more people that way.
Cheers,
QS
I thought it was funny, if it's any consolation prize. :P
m456arcus said: Wow. Really? Wow! That's disturbing. Look at this from the section, 'When Did Dinosaurs Live?':
"Dinosaur bones could not be millions of years old because Adam lived only thousands of years ago."
Because there was no death before Adam sinned, so dinosaurs couldn't have died. Right.
We can just ignore that carbon dating thing, no biggie.
LudwigHeijden said: I am not a Sous chef but I would like to let you know I do not appreciate religions being spread on this forum. Neither politics for that matter. I do understand your question is wether your app is a good idea and I respect that. Leave it with that please.
I sort of agree, it is somewhat bothersome. I can't go anywhere on the internet anymore with out religion be dumped into the conversation some how...
Dizko said: I sort of agree, it is somewhat bothersome. I can't go anywhere on the internet anymore with out religion be dumped into the conversation some how...
This is the first time I've seen any sort of religious discussion on this site, so I don't think it's a big deal really. If you want to avoid the conversation, one can simply not click this thread anymore...
I am not sure why this is so extraordinary or disturbing. The biblical points made in article that was posted are for people who believe the bible is true, the article is not written for atheists, agnostics or the like, since they believe the Bible is rubbish. It is simply showing from the biblical perspective why millions of years is not compatible with the Bible, this is not a scientific article. The website has all sorts of science based articles. It also theological articles, the dinosaur article posted dealt with theological arguments, not scientific ones.
The reason I posted the website in the first place is because there are lots of scientific facts/articles on the site. But, it is a Christian website, so sure there is going to be a Christian interpretation going along with the scientific facts, but there are still facts listed, facts I believe that support the Bible and would help with the development of this app, since it is a religious app.
Example: (someone mentioned carbon dating) Fact from the website: Carbon14 has a rapid rate of decay and cannot be used to date anything over about 80,000 years old because any organic matter older than 80,000 years would not have any carbon14 left in it.
The rate of decay of carbon 14 is a fact. Everyone interprets facts based on what they already believe. If you believe dinosaur bones are millions of years old you will interpret this fact in a different way than if you believe that dinosaurs lived with people and are only thousands of years old.
My point? Scientific facts are always interpreted based on what you already believe. Biblical or non-Biblical.
keweworkshop said: Example: (someone mentioned carbon dating) Fact from the website: Carbon14 has a rapid rate of decay and cannot be used to date anything over about 80,000 years old because any organic matter older than 80,000 years would not have any carbon14 left in it.
But this would still disprove the theory of the earth being 6000 years old (80000 > 6000)
While carbon dating may be the easiest and most common form of radiometric dating it is not the only one. Creationists love to bring it up as though it is the only way dates are worked out. Many different radioactive isotopes exist that can be used, many with half lives in the billions of years.
Nucleocosmochronology is now being used to date things in space. Guess what .... they don't get 6000 years as the answer.
keweworkshop said: My point? Scientific facts are always interpreted based on what you already believe. Biblical or non-Biblical.
Just want to say first that I think creating this app is totally up to you! The point you say above is debatable and I think is biased as it makes whatever anyone says somewhat invalid which is handy when scientists produce facts that can be dismissed as an interpretation. Scientists aim to find the truth regardless of their personal opinion.
This is crazy! I'm 100% against people trying to convinse other people that their religion is more right than any other religion. This is exactly what al qaeda is trying to do(obviously not just with an app, but you get the idea).
And also i highly doubt that this app will do good in any way, since people who are already Christian don't need to be convinced, and people of other religions don't want to be convinced why it's "more right" to be Christian.
So ask yourself this question, if someone made an app on why it's more right to be Jewish, would you become Jewish?
I did not say carbon14 dating proved a young earth, I am saying it disproves fossils being billions of years old. Thank you for bringing up the fact that carbon14 dating is not the only method. Most people believe that carbon dating proves fossils to be billions of years old and it is just not true.
I have not come across creationists only wanting to talk about carbon dating as the only dating method. I love to bring it up to shed light on the subject as so many people equate carbon dating with fossils being millions of years old.
There are so many dating methods, as you stated. Yes some with half-lives in the billions of years. But, we know that radioisotope dating is flawed because we can test it on rocks with known age. A lava rock created in 1986 by the Mount St. Helens eruption was dated using Potassium-Argon dating and it dated between .5 and 2.5 million years old. This is one of lots of examples like that.
The problem with all dating methods is that they all start with assumptions about the way the Earth was billions of years ago. These assumptions can not be proved, but are taken as fact and are not questioned. That is bothersome to me. Even carbon dating starts with assumptions about history that cannot be proven or observed. For carbon dating to be accurate the ratios of c12 to c14 would have had to be equal throughout all of history, how can that be known? It is just a guess. In fact, it has been observed in recent history that the ratios of c12 to c14 are not equal due to the Earth’s magnetic field deteriorating. So how can we say that it was constant in the past when we were not there to study it?
There was pretty recently found soft connective tissue and cells in a T. Rex bone that was supposed to be 60-some million years old (the date stated as a fact). And I don’t think the bone was totally fossilized if I remember correctly. How can a bone and it’s soft tissue last millions of years?
All dating methods are based on certain assumptions about the past. Yet we are told to believe the results without question. I just can’t do it. I think we should all take these “facts” with a grain of salt.
I don’t know what nucleocosmochronology is, never heard of it. I will look it up.
gyroscopeI am here.Member, Sous Chef, PROPosts: 6,598
All dating methods are based on certain assumptions about the past. Yet we are told to believe the results without question. I just can’t do it. I think we should all take these “facts” with a grain of salt.
But you don't take the "facts" written in the books of The Bible with a grain of salt? (Or a very large pile...)
All human life started with just one male and one female? Noah's Ark... two of every creature upon the earth in one wooden floating construction? God as being male? God as a personal deity that answers prayers? A virgin birth? etc., etc., etc.
Of course, you believe what you believe, others who don't believe what you believe, believe something quite different. It'll never change, no point arguing about it (other than entertainment value, to see how many times round the houses we go...)
Good luck to rodh100 with the app. In my opinion, "non-believers" won't buy it though.
Regardless of what some people say how the app will fail, I am still going to make this app and give it a try. I not sure if all of the information is true on the website that someone posted some if probably true and some may not be true. The main goal of this app is just to get non believers talking about the bible and christianity and if they choose to become a christian.
All dating methods are based on certain assumptions about the past. Yet we are told to believe the results without question. I just can’t do it. I think we should all take these “facts” with a grain of salt.
Never ever without question. That is the whole idea of evidence based science, to question. To make the jump from some varying evidence with a few missing facts to the idea that it must be a mystical man in the sky who made everything is just utter nonsense. The one thing religion doesn't have going for it is any evidence what so ever, apart from a book of short stories.
That is why no atheist can ever say they are 100% certain there is no god. I can be 99.99% certain as all the evidence points that way, but as you pointed out our knowledge still has gaps that will in time hopefully be filled as science and technology teaches us new things.
gyroscopeI am here.Member, Sous Chef, PROPosts: 6,598
Hi rodh100, as I said - and others - best of luck with your app. I admire your strength of belief even though I don't believe in what you believe in. But then that's why you're making the app, for people similar to myself... Who knows how successful the app will be? Time will tell, as they say...
A thought: Politics and religion on forums: seperately they cause much argument and disagreement inevitably; combined in the real world, have caused/are causing wars, destruction and thought control.
gyroscope, Thanks for wishing me luck with my app even if you don't have the same beliefs as I do. I agree with you about only time can tell how many downloads the app will have. I hope when my app is on the app store that you will download it
Status Apps, The bible is not just some little book with short stories in it. The bible provides enough evidence for anyone to become a christian. People who study the bible in hopes to prove it wrong almost always become a christian because they realize the bible is true. Many things said in the bible have been scientifically and historically proven so the things said in the bible that we just have to have faith in must be true because it is said in the bible that everything is true along with people proving some of it true. Have you ever read part of the bible Status Apps? If you haven't I hope that you read Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. No one is forcing you to do anything but I just hope you will read a bible and make judgments for yourself instead of relying on internet sources.
rodh100 said: Have you ever read part of the bible Status Apps? If you haven't I hope that you read Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. No one is forcing you to do anything but I just hope you will read a bible and make judgments for yourself instead of relying on internet sources.
I had a christian upbringing and went to a church school. I went to church and sunday school every sunday. I have read the bible cover to cover twice (as an adult) and read (or had read to me) countless passages as a child. Although I had this upbringing my parents never pushed me to actually be a christian and gave me a good education in questioning things to find the truth (without indoctrination). I decided for myself that the whole concept of god (and any deity based religion) is absolutely ridiculous.
While many things in the new testament are historically accurate that doesn't mean there is a god. A book written by people about the time would of course include things that are historically accurate (unlike the mormon bible which is an absolute bunch of BS). There is no scientific evidence for a god. It is that simple. Religion is just blind faith and selective ignorance.
As for recommending books, I highly urge you to read The God Delusion by Richard Dawkins. It is one of those books that tries to address the ignorance that religious people have towards their own faiths and look at the truths they refuse to address. Where as you'll find most atheists will address and tackle any 'proof' that religion tries to bring to the table (usually not much).
**Plus I teach a 6 week course each year in religious practices, histories and origins.**
jonmulcahy said: this forum is not the place to debate the validity of religion. Please keep it on topic (about the app), or I'll have to close it.
Topics says "New App Idea, What do you guys think?".
Are we not still within the bounds of 'What people think about a religious app'? My point simply being from a militant atheist perspective that any app promoting religion is an endeavor to misinform and promote scientific ignorance. Of course that's my opinion, others will differ .... therefore we have a debate.
jonmulcahy said: this forum is not the place to debate the validity of religion. Please keep it on topic (about the app), or I'll have to close it.
Religion is a great way to divide a community as diverse and worldwide as this one. It's really not the place.
Good point. Most people find it hard enough having their opinions challenged , let alone their beliefs.
As for the app, If it looks nice you'll probably get some downloads from people who already agree with you. (And maybe a few from people who already disagree with you)
But just as I can't see anyone changing their beliefs from reading this thread, I doubt anyone will change what they think based on an app.
Regardless of my own beliefs, I think the app is still a good idea. From your perspective, only good can come from it, and like you said if that brings even one person to know Christ (or so to speak) then you have succeeded immensely, I would say.
And I think it's perfectly fine for the community to partake in religious debate, though I think a designated topic in general discussion would be much more appropriate. When I was younger I would spend hours reading and debating religion in forums, and personally learned a lot and grew from the experience. I can understand why some would feel the opposite, though, as it can get heated at times.
I must admit, my two previous posts had nothing to do with the topic at hand. But I just love the debate so much I couldn't help myself!! Especially when it's civil. It's not fun to debate when name calling and anger is involved. I don't want this thread to get closed down, so I'll zip it.
@gyroscope and StusApps, I still have so much to say in regards to your lasts posts that I have not got to comment on yet. Perhaps I will start a thread for us, and anyone else, over in the misc section sometime tonight when I have a free block of time. You can question my beliefs all day long, no offense taken here!
Status Apps, That's sad that read the entire bible and studied it and aren't a christian. I believe that God exists and is here to save us from our sins. I will pray for you that you see the truth and someday become a christian.
rodh100 said: Status Apps, That's sad that read the entire bible and studied it and aren't a christian. I believe that God exists and is here to save us from our sins. I will pray for you that you see the truth and someday become a christian.
Please Do not close this thread anyone
Reading it helped me realise how ridiculous a concept it is. Give me 1 piece of evidence (real evidence, not from the book of short stories) as to the existence of a god and I would happily question and evaluate what I believe in.
I also hope that someday you will see the light, claim back your life and stop believing in things like fairies, unicorns, gods, santa claus or flying spaghetti monsters.
Comments
Ultima, I also appreciate your support! The main goal of this app (and thread) is to get people to christ and to read to bible and learn about god. The goal of this app is not to make money or become popular. I say that god has already made this successful being that this thread is getting many people commenting on it and already has a second page.
Lump Apps and My Assets
Are you the same guy who was making the Crusades game?
Perhaps an atheist version should be made.
That site is absolutely shocking. It's like someone actually setting out to knock down public knowledge and information and replace it with absolute nonsensical crap. I guess that's what they want, return public understanding to the level of the middle ages, when ignorance helped keep religions going. I'm all for free speech but there is not one single evidence based scientific fact given by those idiots (sorry, they use origin based science instead which kinda suggests you can just make up anything you like as long as you can find a bible passage to go with it).
This is priceless: http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/nab/what-happened-to-the-dinosaurs
"Dinosaur bones could not be millions of years old because Adam lived only thousands of years ago."
Because there was no death before Adam sinned, so dinosaurs couldn't have died. Right.
Do you mind if I ask how old you are, rod?
I am not sure why this is so extraordinary or disturbing. The biblical points made in article that was posted are for people who believe the bible is true, the article is not written for atheists, agnostics or the like, since they believe the Bible is rubbish. It is simply showing from the biblical perspective why millions of years is not compatible with the Bible, this is not a scientific article. The website has all sorts of science based articles. It also theological articles, the dinosaur article posted dealt with theological arguments, not scientific ones.
The reason I posted the website in the first place is because there are lots of scientific facts/articles on the site. But, it is a Christian website, so sure there is going to be a Christian interpretation going along with the scientific facts, but there are still facts listed, facts I believe that support the Bible and would help with the development of this app, since it is a religious app.
Example: (someone mentioned carbon dating)
Fact from the website: Carbon14 has a rapid rate of decay and cannot be used to date anything over about 80,000 years old because any organic matter older than 80,000 years would not have any carbon14 left in it.
The rate of decay of carbon 14 is a fact. Everyone interprets facts based on what they already believe. If you believe dinosaur bones are millions of years old you will interpret this fact in a different way than if you believe that dinosaurs lived with people and are only thousands of years old.
My point? Scientific facts are always interpreted based on what you already believe. Biblical or non-Biblical.
While carbon dating may be the easiest and most common form of radiometric dating it is not the only one. Creationists love to bring it up as though it is the only way dates are worked out. Many different radioactive isotopes exist that can be used, many with half lives in the billions of years.
Nucleocosmochronology is now being used to date things in space. Guess what .... they don't get 6000 years as the answer.
And also i highly doubt that this app will do good in any way, since people who are already Christian don't need to be convinced, and people of other religions don't want to be convinced why it's "more right" to be Christian.
So ask yourself this question, if someone made an app on why it's more right to be Jewish, would you become Jewish?
I did not say carbon14 dating proved a young earth, I am saying it disproves fossils being billions of years old. Thank you for bringing up the fact that carbon14 dating is not the only method. Most people believe that carbon dating proves fossils to be billions of years old and it is just not true.
I have not come across creationists only wanting to talk about carbon dating as the only dating method. I love to bring it up to shed light on the subject as so many people equate carbon dating with fossils being millions of years old.
There are so many dating methods, as you stated. Yes some with half-lives in the billions of years. But, we know that radioisotope dating is flawed because we can test it on rocks with known age. A lava rock created in 1986 by the Mount St. Helens eruption was dated using Potassium-Argon dating and it dated between .5 and 2.5 million years old. This is one of lots of examples like that.
The problem with all dating methods is that they all start with assumptions about the way the Earth was billions of years ago. These assumptions can not be proved, but are taken as fact and are not questioned. That is bothersome to me. Even carbon dating starts with assumptions about history that cannot be proven or observed. For carbon dating to be accurate the ratios of c12 to c14 would have had to be equal throughout all of history, how can that be known? It is just a guess. In fact, it has been observed in recent history that the ratios of c12 to c14 are not equal due to the Earth’s magnetic field deteriorating. So how can we say that it was constant in the past when we were not there to study it?
There was pretty recently found soft connective tissue and cells in a T. Rex bone that was supposed to be 60-some million years old (the date stated as a fact). And I don’t think the bone was totally fossilized if I remember correctly. How can a bone and it’s soft tissue last millions of years?
All dating methods are based on certain assumptions about the past. Yet we are told to believe the results without question. I just can’t do it. I think we should all take these “facts” with a grain of salt.
I don’t know what nucleocosmochronology is, never heard of it. I will look it up.
All human life started with just one male and one female? Noah's Ark... two of every creature upon the earth in one wooden floating construction? God as being male? God as a personal deity that answers prayers? A virgin birth? etc., etc., etc.
Of course, you believe what you believe, others who don't believe what you believe, believe something quite different. It'll never change, no point arguing about it (other than entertainment value, to see how many times round the houses we go...)
Good luck to rodh100 with the app. In my opinion, "non-believers" won't buy it though.
""You are in a maze of twisty passages, all alike." - Zork temp domain http://spidergriffin.wix.com/alphaghostapps
That is why no atheist can ever say they are 100% certain there is no god. I can be 99.99% certain as all the evidence points that way, but as you pointed out our knowledge still has gaps that will in time hopefully be filled as science and technology teaches us new things.
A thought: Politics and religion on forums: seperately they cause much argument and disagreement inevitably; combined in the real world, have caused/are causing wars, destruction and thought control.
""You are in a maze of twisty passages, all alike." - Zork temp domain http://spidergriffin.wix.com/alphaghostapps
Status Apps, The bible is not just some little book with short stories in it. The bible provides enough evidence for anyone to become a christian. People who study the bible in hopes to prove it wrong almost always become a christian because they realize the bible is true. Many things said in the bible have been scientifically and historically proven so the things said in the bible that we just have to have faith in must be true because it is said in the bible that everything is true along with people proving some of it true. Have you ever read part of the bible Status Apps? If you haven't I hope that you read Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. No one is forcing you to do anything but I just hope you will read a bible and make judgments for yourself instead of relying on internet sources.
While many things in the new testament are historically accurate that doesn't mean there is a god. A book written by people about the time would of course include things that are historically accurate (unlike the mormon bible which is an absolute bunch of BS). There is no scientific evidence for a god. It is that simple. Religion is just blind faith and selective ignorance.
As for recommending books, I highly urge you to read The God Delusion by Richard Dawkins. It is one of those books that tries to address the ignorance that religious people have towards their own faiths and look at the truths they refuse to address. Where as you'll find most atheists will address and tackle any 'proof' that religion tries to bring to the table (usually not much).
**Plus I teach a 6 week course each year in religious practices, histories and origins.**
Religion is a great way to divide a community as diverse and worldwide as this one. It's really not the place.
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Are we not still within the bounds of 'What people think about a religious app'? My point simply being from a militant atheist perspective that any app promoting religion is an endeavor to misinform and promote scientific ignorance. Of course that's my opinion, others will differ .... therefore we have a debate.
As for the app, If it looks nice you'll probably get some downloads from people who already agree with you. (And maybe a few from people who already disagree with you)
But just as I can't see anyone changing their beliefs from reading this thread, I doubt anyone will change what they think based on an app.
And I think it's perfectly fine for the community to partake in religious debate, though I think a designated topic in general discussion would be much more appropriate. When I was younger I would spend hours reading and debating religion in forums, and personally learned a lot and grew from the experience. I can understand why some would feel the opposite, though, as it can get heated at times.
I must admit, my two previous posts had nothing to do with the topic at hand. But I just love the debate so much I couldn't help myself!! Especially when it's civil. It's not fun to debate when name calling and anger is involved. I don't want this thread to get closed down, so I'll zip it.
@gyroscope and StusApps, I still have so much to say in regards to your lasts posts that I have not got to comment on yet. Perhaps I will start a thread for us, and anyone else, over in the misc section sometime tonight when I have a free block of time. You can question my beliefs all day long, no offense taken here!
Please Do not close this thread anyone
I also hope that someday you will see the light, claim back your life and stop believing in things like fairies, unicorns, gods, santa claus or flying spaghetti monsters.