Yea I agree with Bright Spark. I mean i initially raised the concern because for all i knew this was intentional and not a bug oversight.. Knowing this is not the intended behavior for pro users, I know they will get us a corrected build soon.
I've been using it now for a couple days and while it is annoying its really not that bad.. but i think it could be handled more elegantly.. alternately.. have the popup just flicker.. a quick flash that doesn't require an action.. or even an audio cue (ding) when an ad would pop up. This would make the testing experience less intrusive (clicking ok ok ok) and still server the purpose of reminding the user that this is when that may occur.
Don't understand why so many people are getting so annoyed:
1. The Pro issue is going to be resolved and as the software is still in Beta these small issues should be expected.
Yes, it's in beta, but these are some obvious bugs that should have been caught in QA. Also, the new ad system seems to be affecting other things as well (the timing in my game is completely messed up now and I had to make adjustments just so it would work correctly in .93). I'm trying to resolve some issues with my Android version and now I'm fighting with the new GS version too.
As a paying customer, I think I (and others) have a right to get "annoyed". I'm glad they're fixing it. I hope the fix comes out today. Based on my experience with this update, I'm going to be looking at a couple of alternatives to GS in the event that this becomes a regular thing.
Pretty concerning that a fix has not been deployed for this yet...
If this were any other business, clients would expect a fix within 24 hours, regardless if that meant every single employee did not sleep in that time.
Otherwise, they would have lost said client's business...
can you run the 2 different GS on a cpu, i still have 9.92 on my desk top, so could i continue to build in the new version with he new feature and then use the preview in the older version
This is extremely upsetting, because Gamesalad has now strong-armed me into paying $300 to go PRO.
I have a small team of people, including some professional artists. I have promised them a cut of the revenue.
Consumers simply DO NOT pay for apps that include ads. If I release a $2 app that has in-game ad interruptions, then my app will tank.
Thus, I HAVE to spend another $300 to go PRO just to ensure that my artists will keep working on my game. This greatly increases the risk of this business, and this is extremely upsetting.
I know that Gamesalad has to make money, and that there a lot of non-PRO users that are getting a lot of benefit off of Gamesalad without Gamesalad seeing a cent. This, however, was done with zero transparency to the userbase and seems devious and underhanded.
Surely there is an intermediate solution. I'd gladly pay $100 directly to Gamesalad to avoid these ads - my personal startup costs for app development would be $200. But $400 is a tough pill to swallow. Honestly guys, you didn't think to ask the community what their perceived values of these features are?
though I do not have trouble putting everything in one scene and controlling the camera with a gameAttribute: flow …
I commiserate with those who need many scenes for unique levels … 50 levels … could/would mean 12 ads!
my problem with a yearly proMembership is: what I would get for my money? I can never foresee using … -Monetization … believe that purchase price of my products … is the total cost to user -Android … no performance guarantees for the numerous variant devices' capabilities -Twitter … don't tweet -GameCenter … isn't applicable to the genres I like to do (not that these aren't great for others who want them!)
so in effect, I would be paying for: URL … for links to other games/sites no Ads
IMO $299/yr is a lot to pay for 2 features (though for no Ads … it is looking better!)
I do understand that when one buys an application … there will be many features never used but, that is usually for an app that has high-performance and functionality (GS is rapidly achieving those standards!)
as it stands, I would not be buying a copy of GS for my use but, subscribing for one year's use of features … many with little value to me … isn't practical
I want GS to make money! … and be able to continue to survive and prosper and improve but, I want GS to concentrate of performance and functionality … not the sometimes buggy extras
that vented … had read/write tables been a pro-only feature … I would have spent the $299!
What a pity, was really getting into GS development, thinking the toolset was pretty strong, and looking forward to this update. Really worry this'll split the community, lose GS a lot of users and lack of support will mean less money for everyone.
I can sort of see the logic, as expanded from Freemium or paid Apps, into this software. If free then spam users with Ads, but TBH many of us are trying to move away from this, toward IAPs in Freemium, and additional functionality in paid versions. Ads have their place, to allow users who want to get some free "bucks" for watching them, or to cross-promote, or even on startup, but this sounds like it'd turn any potential user off any game made with GS before they are even engaged with the game.
You'll generally catch far more people, and people who will be far happier to pay if you give them something for their money rather than enforce something really annoying and asking them to pay to remove it!
The main game I'm working on at the moment involves moving between 3 scenes every few seconds. So if an Ad pops up 25% of the time in a 5 minute play session I should expect the user to see about 100 Ads. Not cool.
The main game I'm working on at the moment involves moving between 3 scenes every few seconds. So if an Ad pops up 25% of the time in a 5 minute play session I should expect the user to see about 100 Ads. Not cool.
Truthfully, I don't think I could play a game that changes scenes that often. With some games one scene can take a few seconds and that many would be unbearable with or without ads. Just my two cents.
they're essentially menu pages the player makes selections on before before advancing and repeating. Though due to load time, and now these ads I think I'm going to have to re-engineer the whole structure so it is single scene. Will be much more of a pain to edit and maintain (as you can't hide layers), but them's the breaks I guess...
I knew there would be a firestorm of complaints about the changes in advertising, but they really had 2 options, change ads and keep it free, or loose free and charge a set cost like every other sdk out there.
Gamesalad is not a toy, it is a professional development tool. If you want to make money and put your apps on the app store / android ( which anyone would be a fool to ignore, a number of people on here have posted how well they have done on the nook/kindle fire), $398 is ridiculous low cost of entry.
Doing something professionally costs money, and if you are serious about it, pay the $300. With a half decent game and a little marketing you should earn that back in a few mths.
If all you are interested is trying to make a quick buck, do me a favor and move on, you're cluttering up the app store.
Agreed, $300 isn't much for a piece of professional software, and fully intend on upgrading when I get around to implementing some of the advanced features like IAPs and GameCenter, I just think adding advertising in areas that would put any user off playing the games is a strange idea. I'd think GS are less likely to radically increase revenue due to less new users making the transition to Pro and less players playing apps made with the free version therefore ever seeing the ads. Anyhow, so long as these stop appearing in the preview it doesn't really affect me, as I'll go Pro before launch, just hope it doesn't affect the great community that had grown up to now.
@jonmulcahy No, why would they have literally only 2 options?
With such a robust community, you don't think that the query "Hey, we need to make money somehow, you guys using the freemium version, would you like solution A, B, or C?" I'd be fine with a button for "More Gamesalad games" that featured PRO games on the main menu page of your app. I'd be fine paying a lower sum of money on the freemium version to avoid apps - have a third pay tier rather than "Free" or "$300."
The thing is, is that PRO was marketed as just that, PRO. A lot of sweet features that justify the higher cost. Surprising us all with an update that makes Freemium itself a LOT crappier with no news or explanation is just rude. Yes, Gamesalad is a business, and they need to make money. But part of that process is an open dialogue with its consumers.
You say that within a few months we should "easily" be able to make the $300 back. From earlier discussions I've seen on this forum about launch stats and money made, that really seems to be the exception rather than the rule. Most accounts of impressive launch stats that I've seen here were free games. Which is great! But unfortunately I'm not as awesome as y'all, and I can't do my own art - I have to pay people to do it. And my reliance on other people on my team to generate art makes being strong-armed into PRO leave a very bad taste in my mouth.
Yes, in the grand scheme of things, $300 for what Gamesalad offers is not much. But I don't buy for a SECOND that this was literally the only way they could do things, and that there wasn't a better way that this could be handled. Gamesalad as its tagline is all about the "democratization" of game making. If it's so democratic, then why surprise - key point, because this "feature" wasn't prominently advertised like writing-to-tables was - us with a "feature" that makes the fremium version of the software basically economically unusable for paid apps? Why no discussion, no dialogue?
@MotherHoose And MH brings up an excellent point, that being that some of the features offered by PRO simply don't make sense for all games being made with Gamesalad. Which really means that there absolutely is room for two PRO tierings:
Frankly, listing pro features is meaningless. What you pay for is the ability to publish professional level games which you can charge money for, and BTW it comes with some additional features that you might use or not.
When I switched for Pro there was no Android, IAP or Game Center. It was splash screen, iAds and URL. The only reason I went Pro and paid $499 (not $299, but also not $2000 like some of the others) it was for the Splash Screen. I always knew that if I was serious about my work, there is no way in hell that I'm going to allow some generic splash screen, ad or anything else to be part of my something that I created and was proud of.
So don't look at the pro features, but think of your product and what do you want it to be. Pro is all about who you are and how serious you are about your product, and not how useful each specific feature is.
there happens to be some of us who are trying to make money of our games so we can go pro...
This model died with 92. It does not matter if it is 3, 6 or 12 ads, if it got one, the game better be free. Especially with the PlayHaven-like full screen ads that my young kids keep pressing on by mistake. If someone pays $0.99 and see any of those, thats likely to produce a bad review.
they're essentially menu pages the player makes selections on before before advancing and repeating. Though due to load time, and now these ads I think I'm going to have to re-engineer the whole structure so it is single scene. Will be much more of a pain to edit and maintain (as you can't hide layers), but them's the breaks I guess...
Just change the camera location, that kind of selection should not be in different scene to begin with. Not sure users would like 3 seconds between every selection (regardless of ads).
For what it's worth, IMHO a paid game should never, ever *ever* have ads! If you're a free user, maybe you shouldn't charge for your games. Either that, or GS could get rid of the ability for free users to publish. I'm sure this is an unpopular opinion but these monitization efforts from GS just end up hurting/frustrating Pro users.
Hey guys! I am expecting to hear more detailed information on the upcoming hotfix today. As soon as I know more- I will relay it in the forums.
Until then, we again apologize for the inconvenience and ask for your patience as we diligently work to a cohesive solution for these bugs. Our first priority is to improve your GameSalad development experience.
I agree with GameSalad team that we should wait until they fix this bug. Some bugs can take much longer to get fixed, and I know some of the game salad team members must be working day and night to fix.
However, I don't see any rays of hope after this fix, because I would still be asked to pay $299 to have an ad free app for users. I was working on my current app for almost 3-4 months and almost 2 hour every days, it was coming out a great looking app & I had plans to publish this as free so that this app can reach out to maximum people use iPads.
I am sure many of this community member are full time worker and build their app using game salad in spare time they have, considering such community in a year how many apps one can build and how much money we can make? I don't think it's going to be too much.
I was so attached to the app I was working, lots of effort was put in, and now it seems like I wasted all my hours
I would not think twice if it is $49 or $99 but $399 is too much, and I guess many people who signed up for apple developer program was because of low subscription fees.
I humbly request GameSalad management to let us continue on our current projects without this limitations, or lower down the pro price to $99. I am sure you guys will still be in profit, and you will see more people agree to purchase $99.
Please think of new game developers like, who spend lot of time and energy working on their apps. Please do not kill the joy of creativity & fun.
When I started with GameSalad, I felt like blessing, as it's is such a great tool... and that's why I am saying and other too,... that we don't mind paying $99 and still we are ready to distribute some of our apps for free, but $299 plus $99 to apple, it's basically taking away that blessing ...
@tshirtbooth... thanks a tone... I just can't explain how much you helped me.. I guess I was freaking out for no reason . I am back on 0.9.92, I know I lost work of 2-3 days, because app that I saved with 9.93 can't be opened with 9.92 but it's OK I can spend more hours to bring it back..
I will get on work, and will avoid any upgrades, as I don't need any I am so accustomed and so happy with current GameSalad, that I really don't need anything else..
However, I don't see any rays of hope after this fix, because I would still be asked to pay $299 to have an ad free app for users. I was working on my current app for almost 3-4 months and almost 2 hour every days, it was coming out a great looking app & I had plans to publish this as free so that this app can reach out to maximum people use iPads.
I am sure many of this community member are full time worker and build their app using game salad in spare time they have, considering such community in a year how many apps one can build and how much money we can make? I don't think it's going to be too much.
I was so attached to the app I was working, lots of effort was put in, and now it seems like I wasted all my hours
I would not think twice if it is $49 or $99 but $399 is too much, and I guess many people who signed up for apple developer program was because of low subscription fees.
I humbly request GameSalad management to let us continue on our current projects without this limitations, or lower down the pro price to $99. I am sure you guys will still be in profit, and you will see more people agree to purchase $99.
Please think of new game developers like, who spend lot of time and energy working on their apps. Please do not kill the joy of creativity & fun.
When I started with GameSalad, I felt like blessing, as it's is such a great tool... and that's why I am saying and other too,... that we don't mind paying $99 and still we are ready to distribute some of our apps for free, but $299 plus $99 to apple, it's basically taking away that blessing ...
I just want to address a few points;
If the app is free surely ads in the game won't be an issue? (though I appreciate you would prefer an ad free application) Gamesalad have to cover their overheads and by using their service you are incurring them a cost e.g. cost of bandwidth. To expect the conversation rate from free to pro to cover the operating costs and provide a profit is simply ludicrous.
You say users can't make much but I completely disagree as it is possible to make a nice sum from app development. Though the majority of the community do it mainly for the satisfaction of building games,which is something GameSalad empowers non-programmers to do.
To address your issue with the pricing it seems ridiculous to think that GameSalad could possibly generate a profit from selling pro at $99. The price elasticity of demand of this kind of product is most likely to be fairly price in-elastic with the price being so low already. Remember the price used to be over a thousand dollars which is in line with a lot of other products.
I don't understand why you feel your time has been wasted? Seems that you are very proud of your project and as others have said big games such as draw something have plenty of ads and people aren't that bothered.
I only say this as I feel that you are being slightly dramatic that ads will ruin everything. As I said I think it would be a terrible shame not to go ahead and publish your game!
I am a PRO user. This is frustrating to see this ad interstitial message all the time. Why this upgrade is still available on the 5th of June? Comments are from 31th May saying this was not working.... Is the fix ready? I am now stuck to release my game ... :-(
Answers
I've been using it now for a couple days and while it is annoying its really not that bad.. but i think it could be handled more elegantly.. alternately.. have the popup just flicker.. a quick flash that doesn't require an action.. or even an audio cue (ding) when an ad would pop up. This would make the testing experience less intrusive (clicking ok ok ok) and still server the purpose of reminding the user that this is when that may occur.
As a paying customer, I think I (and others) have a right to get "annoyed". I'm glad they're fixing it. I hope the fix comes out today. Based on my experience with this update, I'm going to be looking at a couple of alternatives to GS in the event that this becomes a regular thing.
If this were any other business, clients would expect a fix within 24 hours, regardless if that meant every single employee did not sleep in that time.
Otherwise, they would have lost said client's business...
I have a small team of people, including some professional artists. I have promised them a cut of the revenue.
Consumers simply DO NOT pay for apps that include ads. If I release a $2 app that has in-game ad interruptions, then my app will tank.
Thus, I HAVE to spend another $300 to go PRO just to ensure that my artists will keep working on my game. This greatly increases the risk of this business, and this is extremely upsetting.
I know that Gamesalad has to make money, and that there a lot of non-PRO users that are getting a lot of benefit off of Gamesalad without Gamesalad seeing a cent. This, however, was done with zero transparency to the userbase and seems devious and underhanded.
Surely there is an intermediate solution. I'd gladly pay $100 directly to Gamesalad to avoid these ads - my personal startup costs for app development would be $200. But $400 is a tough pill to swallow. Honestly guys, you didn't think to ask the community what their perceived values of these features are?
I commiserate with those who need many scenes for unique levels …
50 levels … could/would mean 12 ads!
my problem with a yearly proMembership is: what I would get for my money?
I can never foresee using …
-Monetization … believe that purchase price of my products … is the total cost to user
-Android … no performance guarantees for the numerous variant devices' capabilities
-Twitter … don't tweet
-GameCenter … isn't applicable to the genres I like to do
(not that these aren't great for others who want them!)
so in effect, I would be paying for:
URL … for links to other games/sites
no Ads
IMO $299/yr is a lot to pay for 2 features
(though for no Ads … it is looking better!)
I do understand that when one buys an application … there will be many features never used
but, that is usually for an app that has high-performance and functionality
(GS is rapidly achieving those standards!)
as it stands, I would not be buying a copy of GS for my use
but, subscribing for one year's use of features … many with little value to me
… isn't practical
I want GS to make money! … and be able to continue to survive and prosper and improve
but, I want GS to concentrate of performance and functionality
… not the sometimes buggy extras
that vented … had read/write tables been a pro-only feature … I would have spent the $299!
and, I would pay $99 to have no ads!
Was waiting to see how long you would tune in on this, Again words of wisdom from MH
I can sort of see the logic, as expanded from Freemium or paid Apps, into this software. If free then spam users with Ads, but TBH many of us are trying to move away from this, toward IAPs in Freemium, and additional functionality in paid versions. Ads have their place, to allow users who want to get some free "bucks" for watching them, or to cross-promote, or even on startup, but this sounds like it'd turn any potential user off any game made with GS before they are even engaged with the game.
You'll generally catch far more people, and people who will be far happier to pay if you give them something for their money rather than enforce something really annoying and asking them to pay to remove it!
The main game I'm working on at the moment involves moving between 3 scenes every few seconds. So if an Ad pops up 25% of the time in a 5 minute play session I should expect the user to see about 100 Ads. Not cool.
Gamesalad is not a toy, it is a professional development tool. If you want to make money and put your apps on the app store / android ( which anyone would be a fool to ignore, a number of people on here have posted how well they have done on the nook/kindle fire), $398 is ridiculous low cost of entry.
Doing something professionally costs money, and if you are serious about it, pay the $300. With a half decent game and a little marketing you should earn that back in a few mths.
If all you are interested is trying to make a quick buck, do me a favor and move on, you're cluttering up the app store.
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With such a robust community, you don't think that the query "Hey, we need to make money somehow, you guys using the freemium version, would you like solution A, B, or C?" I'd be fine with a button for "More Gamesalad games" that featured PRO games on the main menu page of your app. I'd be fine paying a lower sum of money on the freemium version to avoid apps - have a third pay tier rather than "Free" or "$300."
The thing is, is that PRO was marketed as just that, PRO. A lot of sweet features that justify the higher cost. Surprising us all with an update that makes Freemium itself a LOT crappier with no news or explanation is just rude. Yes, Gamesalad is a business, and they need to make money. But part of that process is an open dialogue with its consumers.
You say that within a few months we should "easily" be able to make the $300 back. From earlier discussions I've seen on this forum about launch stats and money made, that really seems to be the exception rather than the rule. Most accounts of impressive launch stats that I've seen here were free games. Which is great! But unfortunately I'm not as awesome as y'all, and I can't do my own art - I have to pay people to do it. And my reliance on other people on my team to generate art makes being strong-armed into PRO leave a very bad taste in my mouth.
Yes, in the grand scheme of things, $300 for what Gamesalad offers is not much. But I don't buy for a SECOND that this was literally the only way they could do things, and that there wasn't a better way that this could be handled. Gamesalad as its tagline is all about the "democratization" of game making. If it's so democratic, then why surprise - key point, because this "feature" wasn't prominently advertised like writing-to-tables was - us with a "feature" that makes the fremium version of the software basically economically unusable for paid apps? Why no discussion, no dialogue?
$100: No ads
$300: All PRO features
When I switched for Pro there was no Android, IAP or Game Center. It was splash screen, iAds and URL. The only reason I went Pro and paid $499 (not $299, but also not $2000 like some of the others) it was for the Splash Screen. I always knew that if I was serious about my work, there is no way in hell that I'm going to allow some generic splash screen, ad or anything else to be part of my something that I created and was proud of.
So don't look at the pro features, but think of your product and what do you want it to be. Pro is all about who you are and how serious you are about your product, and not how useful each specific feature is.
This model died with 92. It does not matter if it is 3, 6 or 12 ads, if it got one, the game better be free. Especially with the PlayHaven-like full screen ads that my young kids keep pressing on by mistake. If someone pays $0.99 and see any of those, thats likely to produce a bad review. Just change the camera location, that kind of selection should not be in different scene to begin with. Not sure users would like 3 seconds between every selection (regardless of ads).
For what it's worth, IMHO a paid game should never, ever *ever* have ads! If you're a free user, maybe you shouldn't charge for your games. Either that, or GS could get rid of the ability for free users to publish. I'm sure this is an unpopular opinion but these monitization efforts from GS just end up hurting/frustrating Pro users.
Until then, we again apologize for the inconvenience and ask for your patience as we diligently work to a cohesive solution for these bugs. Our first priority is to improve your GameSalad development experience.
However, I don't see any rays of hope after this fix, because I would still be asked to pay $299 to have an ad free app for users. I was working on my current app for almost 3-4 months and almost 2 hour every days, it was coming out a great looking app & I had plans to publish this as free so that this app can reach out to maximum people use iPads.
I am sure many of this community member are full time worker and build their app using game salad in spare time they have, considering such community in a year how many apps one can build and how much money we can make? I don't think it's going to be too much.
I was so attached to the app I was working, lots of effort was put in, and now it seems like I wasted all my hours
I would not think twice if it is $49 or $99 but $399 is too much, and I guess many people who signed up for apple developer program was because of low subscription fees.
I humbly request GameSalad management to let us continue on our current projects without this limitations, or lower down the pro price to $99. I am sure you guys will still be in profit, and you will see more people agree to purchase $99.
Please think of new game developers like, who spend lot of time and energy working on their apps. Please do not kill the joy of creativity & fun.
When I started with GameSalad, I felt like blessing, as it's is such a great tool... and that's why I am saying and other too,... that we don't mind paying $99 and still we are ready to distribute some of our apps for free, but $299 plus $99 to apple, it's basically taking away that blessing
I will get on work, and will avoid any upgrades, as I don't need any I am so accustomed and so happy with current GameSalad, that I really don't need anything else..
Once again... thanks a lot......
If the app is free surely ads in the game won't be an issue? (though I appreciate you would prefer an ad free application) Gamesalad have to cover their overheads and by using their service you are incurring them a cost e.g. cost of bandwidth. To expect the conversation rate from free to pro to cover the operating costs and provide a profit is simply ludicrous.
You say users can't make much but I completely disagree as it is possible to make a nice sum from app development. Though the majority of the community do it mainly for the satisfaction of building games,which is something GameSalad empowers non-programmers to do.
To address your issue with the pricing it seems ridiculous to think that GameSalad could possibly generate a profit from selling pro at $99. The price elasticity of demand of this kind of product is most likely to be fairly price in-elastic with the price being so low already. Remember the price used to be over a thousand dollars which is in line with a lot of other products.
I don't understand why you feel your time has been wasted? Seems that you are very proud of your project and as others have said big games such as draw something have plenty of ads and people aren't that bothered.
I only say this as I feel that you are being slightly dramatic that ads will ruin everything. As I said I think it would be a terrible shame not to go ahead and publish your game!