Best Marketing Tool I have Found To Date
FallacyStudios
Member Posts: 970
Hey guys,
So as of lately I have been doing a lot of research trying to find the best ways to market. I have spent countless hours researching. As you are well aware the market is diluted and it feels impossible to get noticed sometimes. One area that I haven't bothered looking into until recently was optimizing my store page. It seems so obvious in retrospect, but up until now I have been focused on looking into marketing. I came across the video below and figured I would check the tool out. My mind was blown with how awesome this tool is.
I don't know about you, but when I input keywords I generally find it one of the hardest things to do. Sometimes I have too many and other times I can't think of enough words to fill it. I never really put too much effort into it because I assumed that just putting in something like "bird" or "angry" or "flappy" would help it get noticed. Obviously that doesn't work when the market becomes diluted. Anyways, long story short I found this tool and I thought I would share it with you guys as I am sure many of you want to get ahead of the market.
My experience so far with this tool has been awesome. I mean it is so freaking easy to use. Just look up keywords and you can see their traffic and how diluted they are with competition. It even lets you look at other apps keyword lists. I found this extremely helpful because I look into top chart apps and try to find their keywords that aren't as over used. (On a side note, I found a few of them using keywords they should consider optimizing themselves). The new app I have been working on, (I'll announce probably next week), I had been struggling to find keywords. After using this tool I found what seems to be the best keywords for my purpose. All in all I now have 24 keywords on Apple tiny keyword list and all of them show up as high traffic and relatively low competition. I have a really good feeling about my apps visibility. I'll launch it as soon as I feel 0.11.0 is stable enough and I'll post back here to let you guys know how it is working out. I also found that even my popular apps drastically need an overhaul on their keyword lists. I'll let you know how that goes on their next update if I notice drastic differences. Anyways, enjoy if you find a use for it, if not no big. Feel free to ask questions about it and I'll try and help you from the testing I have done.
P.S. If you use it, let me know what you think. If you find other awesome optimization or marketing tactics let me know as well as I am always looking for good ways to stay ahead of the curve. :P
Comments
Interesting... thanks for the share! Was this your "honest review" to get it for free?
Oh shiz you can get it free? Link?
Edit: Oh I see what you mean. I wonder if this would work? It says blog and I don't have one.
Well I used their test to look for my App and received an 'F' rating.. hah, I don't know if this is their marketing ploy to get me to download it, but I'm going to anyways. I have a few days before Apple approves an update for my App so may as well give it a go.
Thanks
Edit- seems like a method for tracking keyword searches.. I thought it came up with a recommended keyword list based on info you give.
@TouchiMedia ... I didn't download anything. I just logged in through my gmail and tried it out. I didn't even know they had a rating thing lol. Now I'm curious as to what mine are.
So far I've mainly used the Keyword Research to find better words and Keyword Spy for figuring out what others are using. Although I'm going to need to use the Translation one for my current game. Not exactly sure what keywords to use for other languages.
Did you get an upgrade to your account for doing this promo for them?
It is important to be honest about these things.
We have used Sensor Tower in the past mainly for keyword research, like @FallacyStudios mentioned. So we might look at what our competition is using for keywords and get good ideas for our own. I can say that the keywords that they say are being used are about 85% correct. When we put in our own apps and had them search our keywords, that's what we found. 85% correct. But that's good enough for me. I'm just looking for ideas, and it usually gives plenty to work with.
Seems interesting and possibly worthwhile, thanks, @FallacyStudios, for the heads-up.
One thing that I thought though, I wonder what percentage of total app buyers actually search for apps to buy with keywords? Less than 50%, surely.... but sensor tower seems a useful tool all the same, based on those that do use them.
Edit: seems a good service but plans are expensive for what's offered, in my opinion.
""You are in a maze of twisty passages, all alike." - Zork temp domain http://spidergriffin.wix.com/alphaghostapps
Yes. And it seems to contradict itself. Says to use keywords that are searched for most, but least competition. But if you are searching for a word that is used most in games, then it'd have a lot of competition?
I don't know - I wouldn't expect miracle download turnarounds. As gyroscope said, how many people actually search for games based on keywords? I'm a pretty avid Apple Store gamer, and never search for a game based on keywords. Usually see an article covering it, an advertisement, website, etc. I'd even say less then 25% actively search the App store with keywords in mind. Most just go by the App Stores ranking, top 10 or 20 , that's what I do and suspect most people do.
@lycettebros No I haven't. Would be nice though.
@wpaten Yea I was wondering how accurate it was. From what I could tell it seemed to be pretty accurate off my own stuff. You are right at the very least it helped me come up with keywords I wouldn't have even thought of. After I submit the current game and update my app next month I'll submit a new set of keywords produced from this and see what happens to my ranking and downloads. I'll post my results if anyone is curious to know.
@gyroscope No problem. Yea I know what you mean, but aren't keywords processed off of whatever they type in? I read an article recently suggesting that like (60% I think it said) is found that way. One article said as much as 80% is found organically. http://www.apptamin.com/blog/optimize-play-store-app/ Not sure how accurate that is or not. In any case, 50% of the market is a huge number to be working with. Yea I was thinking the same thing about price. I kind of wish they would drop it some, but I can see how it could be worth it if I see an improvement. That is why thus far I have used whatever it allows me to do free to rebuild a new keyword list. Going to drop it on 2 of my apps and see if it creates an improvement that makes it worth buying. If it creates a sizable improvement, I'd rather spend the money with something I can see working as I have been hearing a lot lately that running ads (without tons of money) is like a drop in the bucket. Just curious, is there anything you have been using that is working for you?
@TouchiMedia
Nah what it is saying does make sense. Here look.
So this is from the Keyword Research tool. Basically what it is telling you to do is look at traffic and weigh it against the difficulty. So if you look at the screen shots. If you search the term "bird", its traffic is 5/10 and the difficulty is 6/10. That is worse than "angry" which is traffic 6/10 and difficulty 5/10.
So basically, if I have a limited number of keywords, I would remove bird to keep angry because it receives higher traffic and is less difficult to reach the top of.
From my research, organic browsing is apparently the highest. Apparently articles, websites, and advertisements are lower on that scale. Just what I have read. Here is one of those articles.
http://blog.kissmetrics.com/app-store-optimization/
The bar graph on the first page.
We'll see.. I use keywords that describe my game and are related/interchangeable to the title name. I'm not sure what else there is to do.
Since Flappy Birds was such a huge hit / trend, and then was taken down. I'm guessing majority of people were searching for 'flappy' - but since there's a lot of clones with Flappy - you're saying not to include that in your keyword search. But that is what majority of people will be searching / looking for.... ???
I think the most important is have an original App, and advertise it , hope it gets covered on some news sites, or media outlets, etc.
I don't think Flappy Birds success came from keyword search. He inadvertnly got a lot of attention from a lot of popular media outlets - which then spread like wildfire.
Just my opinion, it probably is wrong.. best of luck, and definitely let us know the results! Thanks for posting as any information is good information
@TouchiMedia Yea I'm certainly no pro with page optimization. Honestly this my first attempt. I was thinking along the same lines as you with putting in terms like flappy because that is probably what people are looking for. I just found most the articles I read recently talking about optimization suggested picking keywords that are searched, but aren't as heavily diluted as flappy would be for example. It is just if you use terms that are over used your app just falls into the mess and becomes even harder to find. When you use terms that are searched frequently, but aren't over used your app has a greater chance to be found and essentially move up the ranks. That's what those articles say anyways. I have nothing to lose so figured I would give that a try.
Yea you are right. Flappy bird was found because of PewDiePie wasn't it? In any case, if someone like him covers your game, your app getting noticed is guaranteed. Those are rare occasions. The link with the chart is basically just saying that the majority are spread from either coming across them on the market or word of mouth.
And your opinion may not even be wrong. Really, to each his own. I just figured I would give keyword optimization a shot as it couldn't hurt. Yea I'll post back my results. My new game won't be of much help comparison wise as it is new with no current trends, but I'll give some insight into it. As for my other game and application, when I update them I have current stats I can compare them too so I can give you guys a % increase or decrease.
@FallacyStudios Sounds like a good plan.
I just have a hard time fathoming this: ' terms that are searched frequently but aren't over used. '
But aren't 'terms that are searched frequently' = 'over used'...
It may indeed make a difference, but how big- is what we will soon find out.
I been experimenting with various advertising options, like ios iads and facebook promotion for app page. Both have gotten a lot of hits - but not a lot of downloads. Not too bad, up over 300 now in about 5 days but it's no flappy birds
How's that old phrase go? 'Got to spend money to make money' ...
I'm glad we are at least banging heads together to come up with some ideas. Getting your App known is about 3/4 of the battle imo.
@TouchiMedia Essentially what I mean by that is words that people search, but aren't used as keywords. Think of it this way. As a developer on your app you have 100 characters you can put into your keyword area. Out of those, many developers go straight to gimmes like game, fun, rts, tower defense, and so on. Many other developers jump on bandwagons like bird, angry, flappy, clash, clans, and so on. By the end of it, most of their words are probably the same words used by the mass majority of developers. They might have some unique ones sprinkled in, but most go straight to what they assume gets lots of traffic.
Now from the users perspective, lets say this guy wants to find an angry type of game. He is all pissed off and wants to vent his frustrations on something. Just messing around he types in mad. Mad is a common word, but isn't something that is as heavily diluted as angry. It still gets lots of traffic because people use a variety of vocabulary. It's not all the same things. By you going outside the box and using words that people use, but developers aren't focused on, it essentially gives you less overall competition when that word is searched. Thus make the likelihood of your app getting found that much better.
Now if you had a hit game on your hands, by all means use all the super common words. Your app will automatically show higher because your app is already popular, but when you are just launching your app you need to get it noticed first. That's why a few of what I had read suggested constantly updating your keywords and refining them as your game gets more popular or when you find some words work well and others don't. That's basically why I find this tool useful. In my opinion anyhow.
It just makes sense to me anyways. Didn't even really think of it that way until I started looking into keyword optimization. Like you said though, we will find out off my results. After a few attempts of getting it, if I don't see good results, atleast we know that it isn't as important as say marketing. If however, I start seeing leaps in downloads this will certainly be the route I'd rather go.
Yea it is good to discuss it. I've been looking for some really solid methods and most of what I hear is just hearsay. Nice to get these kinds of discussions going in the community and help each other find solid methods of getting our apps noticed.
Taking another look at the site, I can't believe that so many companies would pay such a high price for relatively straightforward statistical analysis (of keywords only), month after month... (supposedly 20,000 companies, they show 22 icons which don't even have links to check them out)....and anyway, if keywords are such a gamechanger, surely you, I and/or a lot of companies could experiment over 6 months, changing the keywords, and save ourselves a lot of money...
As I say, I can't believe that anything but a small minority search for apps via the search box with keywords, other than the major headings.... utilities, entertainment, etc...
So I personally think that, while choosing the right keywords is important and helpful to a small degree, you are not going to influence sales in any major way by changing keywords...I just can't see it...
I know that I wouldn't think of paying even their minimum plan price of $79 a month, every month just for data on keyword frequency... (which probably changes from month to month anyhow so there's no real way to get to grips with such "slippery" data)....personally I would run a mile from this company... there's no magic bullet to suddenly up your sales, and even if there was, this isn't it...
I'm about to start getting my apps a bit more exposure if pos. by using prmac and also sending out promo codes to review sites. If these places pick up on your game/app, then there really is the possibility for real sales spikes, I think....
I wrote a thread about prMac and a list of review sites (and a whole raft of vids on app marketing from another member there too), if you're interested in checking it all out:
http://forums.gamesalad.com/discussion/63304/marketing-your-app-pr-list-of-100-review-sites#latest
Hope that helps.
""You are in a maze of twisty passages, all alike." - Zork temp domain http://spidergriffin.wix.com/alphaghostapps
@gyroscope I agree. I think keywords are important but I don't think it's going to change sales much. Getting your App known seems to be far more bigger impact.
@FallacyStudios I read those articles from 2012 about how 60% polled would search using keywords. I still find that really hard to believe. Of the 5 friends I have talked to who are avid iOS gamers.. they all say same - either a review site or featured app or top 10 or word of mouth is what they really only pay attention to. And if you think, how often have YOU searched for a game based on key words? I know for me, I never done it. And I played hundreds of iOS games.
But I'm glad this is being discussed cause it's all great info. Just don't expect miracle spikes with keywords
@gyroscope
Yea I get what you are saying. I guess I'm different. When I mess around in the app store I generally just type in words looking for something. Most the time I'm not looking for anything specific. People like me would be who you would mainly target through keywords.
Thing is if this is such a simple statistical analysis, why aren't there more programs like it? I've only found a few. Google adwords tool was an option I tried out, but my opinion of it was that it was poor, clunky, and geared more toward web traffic. Essentially you could say the same thing about SEO because that is basically what this is. Do you think SEO is pointless? Cause it seems like a lot of companies invest a ton of money in it. Because developers aren't currently investing in ASO as much yet, doesn't mean it isn't important.
As for the $79. Yea I agree it seems like a lot. Honestly though if I were to spend $80 on a CPI marketing campaign that would result in maybe 40-80 downloads. That few downloads won't result in any kind of increase in rank. So in my point of view if optimizing keywords results in only 10 spots higher, but those 10 spots result in 100 more downloads. That is more worth it than the marketing avenue. (In this situation of course.) Like I said, before I go spending that much on it I'm testing it out on some of my apps first, personally. If I notice improvements enough to counter that cost, I have no issue paying for it.
@TouchiMedia Yea, like I just said above. I actually look up keywords more often than I look for specific games. Here I just read this interesting read:
http://www.insidemobileapps.com/2013/05/17/google-discloses-how-search-for-google-play-works-for-the-first-time-12-percent-of-dau-search-for-apps-daily/
Bit more recent for you. That's out of the mouth of a Google rep whom says it is more effective too. As for your friends, of course they aren't keywording it. Most avid gamers are frequents to gaming sites and blogs. Although, the larger part of the market is casual gamers. I'm a casual gamer and I virtually never go to review sites. Most of my searches involve keywords. Not bsing, just being honest.
Interesting indeed. I'd think casual gamers also just look at top 10 or 40 in whatever category as they don't want to spend the time searching for keywords.
Oh well - stats don't lie!!
@FallacyStudios
I'm still not convinced, sorry to say... I don't think tweaking keywords has that much clout that you think it has... and even if it had, the service offered is far too expensive (not just personally but in the scheme of things). In fact, I'd go as far as to say, it's a crazy, rip-off price based on the supposed service offered...
I'll say again, tweaking keywords, whether for apps or website optimisation surely can make a difference but to the majority, such a tiny difference...
I'll be prepared to eat my words if you can show me real proof that paying a minimum of $79 a month for keyword "optimisation" only, has actually benefitted you... (if you go ahead)... but I'd still say you'd be pouring money down the drain which could be spent in a much more advantageous way; and I would advice you against it....
....One last thing... so example... let's assume your app is pretty much doing OK, 100 downloads a day... that's approx. 3000 downloads a month.... you pay $79 per month for "help" to amend your keywords, this has an incredible 5% more effect.... so you have 60 downloads more, each at .99c, making approx. $60... so..... you've lost at least $19 (your monthly fee of $79 minus your extra earnings of $60) and in effect not gained anything at all, just lost money....
""You are in a maze of twisty passages, all alike." - Zork temp domain http://spidergriffin.wix.com/alphaghostapps
@TouchiMedia
Yea. I'm sure many of them do. I don't, but that sounds plausible to me. I think I've only clicked on the top apps section a handful of times on my phone. Really only to do app research lol.
Lol well they do sometimes :P.
@gyroscope
No worries dude. It makes no difference to me whether you want to use it or not. I just found it and it was exactly what I was looking for. Thus far my experience using it, because btw you are aware you can just try it out as I have been, has been very optimistic. Although I too could eat my words. Thus why I want to test out the keywords on my apps to see the kind of difference it makes before purchasing.
I'll be upfront with it. If I find it makes no real difference. I'll post it here. I don't want to be blamed for someone spending money on something that doesn't work. Don't think I am endorsing it as a perfect tool that is guaranteed to make a difference. I'm just saying so far I see the potential and pointing anyone who wants to take a look in the direction. Whatever my results are, (I'll submit after 11.0 is stable), I'll repost on here for you to check out. If it does work, then I'll be happy that I found a useful tool.
My example figures weren't intended to be literal. I was merely pointing out that if it does have a decent impact on rankings it would be more worth your money than your advertising using a CPI. If you apply your same number logic using the advertising CPI you would be wasting more money and be paying to get users anyways.
Edit: Btw, have you seen anything saying that you have to have it for a minimum of 12 months or something? I haven't and I'm just curious.
Your logic understood! A free trial is good - at least you're not going to lose any money and you can try it out for free for a while - I'll be interested in the results (and be prepared to "eat my hat"!)
""You are in a maze of twisty passages, all alike." - Zork temp domain http://spidergriffin.wix.com/alphaghostapps
Me too, I'll eat too! Haha, I hope I'm wrong.
@gyroscope No I'm saying you can try it free too lol. All I did was sign in with my gmail and I was able to access some of the searches and analytics for abit. Enough time to put together what seems to be a solid keyword list. If you prefer to wait for me to get some results to share that's cool too.
No offense, but I on the other hand hope you guys are wrong and do have to eat your words/(hat?) lol.
keywords are the bane of my existence. I know I could (and should) be doing better, but it's a full time job in itself to go about doing this stuff.
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Yea Sensor Tower is a great "tool". You can see how much an app is worth....ratings...yes the keyword search....I look at it fairly regular. I also have checked many many pages on GS and games made by GS based on "Announce your Game"....some of you are doing pretty good....some of the people here I thought would be doing VERY well....not so.
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But does it make a difference, well or not, is the big question.
It's an interesting site for sure, but I won't be investing in it, and will write to them to let them know that (as they wrote to me asking if I needed help with anything. How kind!)
I think using anecdotal evidence to suggest something works or doesn't work won't really help matters.
I search using keywords on the app store if I'm looking for a particular kind of game to fit my mood e.g. shmup and hardly ever look at the top charts.
Others only look at the top charts and never search.
Who do you believe? Who's right?
Essentially, I think both things happen, so it's all useful.
If nothing else, I learned that I shouldn't include keywords I already have in the title of my app - I thought that was true to begin with, but that it changed to searches not including the title - evidently it's changed back again!
EDIT:
I should also add that PRMac has done nothing for me. I've used them on 5 apps and the only time it made a difference was with the original Air Supply - and I doubt it had anything to do with the press release!
I will still use it as it's very cheap to get the word out, but it only seems to attract interest from advertisers or the scummy 'pay for a review' types, which is a waste of my time.
In closing, I don't think there's an easy/quick fix!
Dr. Sam Beckett never returned home...
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yea i've found my success with PRMac has gone down. In the beginning I would get a few review requests, but now it's just the people asking me to pay for 'expedited reviews'.
I've started to put together my own press contacts list to send out to, but it's in the early stages.
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