Here's another idea (unless someone already said it in the hundreds of other posts...):
The rev sharing, where GS publish the app and give you say 70% of what they get from Apple, is just a forced variation of a standard approach. The standard approach, which long ago Macromedia used to do for example, is to charge a fixed amount or percentage for each unit sold. In the days of CD-ROMs that might mean $2 per disc to Macromedia. I have no idea how it was policed, but they did eventually drop the scheme. What Macromedia could have done is to publish everyones CD-ROMs, and send all but $2 of the income back to the developer. That would have guaranteed that the developer did in fact pay the $2 per unit, but would have left you worried whether Macromedia would send the money some time soon.
In any case, someone publishing your title and sending you all but their cut of the income, and someone charging you a fixed amount or percentage for each unit you publish yourself, are just the same thing. All that changes is whose accountant has to send money. Plus some concerns until you're sure about whether they would brand your app as theirs, or, conversely, you would show their logo in the credits screen if you did the publishing.
So, an idea that might work here is this:
GS Direct: Free GS Pro software, and GS publishes your title, branded as your work, but would show up under GS in the App Store. They would send you 70% of what they receive from Apple.
GS Enterprise: Free GS Pro software, you would publish it yourself, under your own Apple account, and you would send GS 30% of what Apple give you, as the license fee. There could also be a charge for the build stage, as I don't think GS would let that out of house.
The overall income to GS would be the same as if there was just Direct, but anyone who wanted to pay the extra money to Apple, the charge for doing builds, and handle the headache of sending the license fees, would at least remain as independent as they are with the current Pro version.
There is an app store for apple TV for sure, full HD, new market, maybe compatible with iOS game, but sure have it own app, just like ipad, that was a lot of publisher waiting for!
TechnoDave said: I completely agree! I wish everyone would stop throwing out numbers in this forum. What we all need to be pushing for is that they keep a Pro option!
Couple of points about the DIY numbers: Not sure about anyone else, but I use 70% on the assumption that the figure will be that or better. If it's less, then the amount of money that the developer receives would be less than 50%, and that doesn't sound like it's "favorable to the developer".
The other thing is that the COO is reading these threads. Even with our suggestions being uninformed and naive, something might get suggested that the COO thinks is worthwhile, which would hopefully then improve the deal we're given.
CoIin said: Couple of points about the DIY numbers: Not sure about anyone else, but I use 70% on the assumption that the figure will be that or better. If it's less, then the amount of money that the developer receives would be less than 50%, and that doesn't sound like it's "favorable to the developer".
The other thing is that the COO is reading these threads. Even with our suggestions being uninformed and naive, something might get suggested that the COO thinks is worthwhile, which would hopefully then improve the deal we're given.
I agree. Our suggestions reveal what we'd like to see, what we can live with, as well as our passion -- there's definitely a lot of passion among GameSalad users!
There's no harm in brainstorming solutions, and like you say, perhaps some ideas might be incorporated in a solution that benefits all of us.
Dragokillz said: Just narrow it down for me please, I have places to go.
Is GameSalad going to be getting a percentage of our sales forever? Or is it just a one-time payment?
I have enough "Percentage" deals happening right now, Music, Funding this is annoying.
I have a game about to be born and I don't want a burden with more sale tax!
Based on the FAQ, it's going to be a permanent, but tiered revenue split. The more you make, the less they'll take. I don't know if it's going to be based on a particular range, or cumulative, but it's definitely going to be split as long as they're publishing it for you.
Thank you for all of the responses to our FAQ. Here are some additional answers based on questions we’ve seen come across.
MarcinMakaj asked: "Will people with an active membership be able to use this PRO featured version of GS, AND publish their game in the old way?"
If you currently hold a “Pro” subscription, you will be able to use the “Pro” featured version of GameSalad Direct and publish “the old way” until your subscription ends. However, if you are an “Express” subscription holder, you will not be able to use certain features that are reserved solely for “Pro” subscription holders (specifically, iAds, custom splash screens and URL forwarding).
Chunkypixels asked: "Is publishing through Direct going to be the only option available, or can users have an option to still publish their own apps without having to go through Direct?"
We understand the concerns raised by members of this community and we're currently exploring options to address those concerns.
"What happens with Promo Codes?"
GameSalad will retain 10 promo codes per app for press reviews and marketing purposes. The other 40 will go straight to the developer.
"What improvements do current subscribers have access to until their accounts expire?"
Subscribers will get access to all GameSalad updates available under their subscription.
Ok what about the other question... When you going to release this direct stuff?, we r dying here... waiting for it. Is it a frame time that we should know...
GameSalad said: We understand the concerns raised by members of this community and we're currently exploring options to address those concerns.
Good... but you don't have to think too hard. Just turn Pro back on. Heh, I imagine there would be a lot more Pro subscribers after this incident.
...and with GameSalad Direct® I could test the iAds business model. If it works, then I can upgrade to Pro. I think a week is long enough to resolve this problem. Your reputation is getting killed out there. It's not good for business.
iDeveloper said: I highly doubt your working on "other options". Did I since fear in that yellow-post?
Why so negative?
Obviously they are considering other options because the GameSalad Direct® only option will result in the loss of customers and damage the reputation of GameSalad.
I've been working on Annoyed Tomatoes and I don't think I could make a game like that with Corona or Unity, not with the speed I'm achieving. If you're going to use other software, then just go. I don't write letters to Coca-Cola informing them that I'm brushing my teeth and drinking water.
UPDATE: The GameSalad account avatar now has color, perhaps things will get better. It's proof that the GameSalad team is willing to make improvements based on community feedback.
They know there are options available, such as different memberships. "We want PRO back", "We don't want Direct", "Here's a solution". The C.O.O has read those posts, but doesn't want to admit the wrong doing GameSalad has done.
Their Timeline Announcement ---> FAQ #1 ---> Mini FAQ ---> Another FAQ On The Way?
I also guess you haven't heard of opinion. You can't just automatically assume a post is bashing them.
iDeveloper said: The C.O.O has read those posts, but doesn't want to admit the wrong doing GameSalad has done.
Incorrect!
The C.O.O stated, "I apologize for that mistake" in the first post of this thread. That's the first step to resolving this issue. The second is coming up with a solution that is good for business... one that makes customers and the GameSalad team happy.
@ Head Chef - "...we're currently exploring options..."
I'm glad you're talking, and hopeful you'll come up with a hybrid solution (Direct option, Pro option) that makes good business sense for you as well as the diverse needs of your community of developers.
Unfortunately if they still keep PRO for $2000, that still way too high. Not everybody is a FMG or TSB or Utopian (I mean this in a good way)
We are working hard and like I said before, getting better on each 'taptard'.
There's a market for everyone and since the App store is very unpredictable, who knows who/what will make the next hit.
I rather see something similar to Corona ~$499 per year with current express and pro available; I'm assuming there's more than 1000 GS users utilizing their software...that's about half a million bucks they can make easily and if the word spread, they could easily hit 10,000 users in the next couple of months.
On top of that, they could offer GS Direct for 'amateurs' that want to give it a try and taste the water on the app store without investing more than what GS takes.
This way, there IS an option to go up and down.
GS could keep being a software company while at the same time been introduce as a publisher.
rdcube said: Unfortunately if they still keep PRO for $2000, that still way too high. Not everybody is a FMG or TSB or Utopian (I mean this in a good way)
Depends, $2000 is not so bad if the software is bug free, fast and contains competitive features. As it was there was not enough above the $99 express to justify the $2000 (unless you were making for clients).
I nearly bought it twice in the last couple of months and would have done if they could have guaranteed that pricing was not gonna change.
This for me is a very positive announcement. Knowing we will get access to the updates that direct users will is very important. Just sort a model for self publishing and we are sorted!!
Thank you for all of the responses to our FAQ. Here are some additional answers based on questions we’ve seen come across.
MarcinMakaj asked: "Will people with an active membership be able to use this PRO featured version of GS, AND publish their game in the old way?"
If you currently hold a “Pro” subscription, you will be able to use the “Pro” featured version of GameSalad Direct and publish “the old way” until your subscription ends. However, if you are an “Express” subscription holder, you will not be able to use certain features that are reserved solely for “Pro” subscription holders (specifically, iAds, custom splash screens and URL forwarding).
this worries me because now they are basicly saying oh now you have to go with gamesalad diredt for custom loading screens iAds and Links!!!!!!!
StusApps said: Depends, $2000 is not so bad if the software is bug free, fast and contains competitive features. As it was there was not enough above the $99 express to justify the $2000 (unless you were making for clients).
I nearly bought it twice in the last couple of months and would have done if they could have guaranteed that pricing was not gonna change.
That's still to much just because it's bug free don't mean anything. $299-$499 is fine I think.
Comments
The rev sharing, where GS publish the app and give you say 70% of what they get from Apple, is just a forced variation of a standard approach. The standard approach, which long ago Macromedia used to do for example, is to charge a fixed amount or percentage for each unit sold. In the days of CD-ROMs that might mean $2 per disc to Macromedia. I have no idea how it was policed, but they did eventually drop the scheme. What Macromedia could have done is to publish everyones CD-ROMs, and send all but $2 of the income back to the developer. That would have guaranteed that the developer did in fact pay the $2 per unit, but would have left you worried whether Macromedia would send the money some time soon.
In any case, someone publishing your title and sending you all but their cut of the income, and someone charging you a fixed amount or percentage for each unit you publish yourself, are just the same thing. All that changes is whose accountant has to send money. Plus some concerns until you're sure about whether they would brand your app as theirs, or, conversely, you would show their logo in the credits screen if you did the publishing.
So, an idea that might work here is this:
GS Direct: Free GS Pro software, and GS publishes your title, branded as your work, but would show up under GS in the App Store. They would send you 70% of what they receive from Apple.
GS Enterprise: Free GS Pro software, you would publish it yourself, under your own Apple account, and you would send GS 30% of what Apple give you, as the license fee. There could also be a charge for the build stage, as I don't think GS would let that out of house.
The overall income to GS would be the same as if there was just Direct, but anyone who wanted to pay the extra money to Apple, the charge for doing builds, and handle the headache of sending the license fees, would at least remain as independent as they are with the current Pro version.
That is a Big Money!
The other thing is that the COO is reading these threads. Even with our suggestions being uninformed and naive, something might get suggested that the COO thinks is worthwhile, which would hopefully then improve the deal we're given.
There's no harm in brainstorming solutions, and like you say, perhaps some ideas might be incorporated in a solution that benefits all of us.
Is GameSalad going to be getting a percentage of our sales forever? Or is it just a one-time payment?
I have enough "Percentage" deals happening right now, Music, Funding this is annoying.
I have a game about to be born and I don't want a burden with more sale tax!
Thank you for all of the responses to our FAQ. Here are some additional answers based on questions we’ve seen come across.
MarcinMakaj asked: "Will people with an active membership be able to use this PRO featured version of GS, AND publish their game in the old way?"
If you currently hold a “Pro” subscription, you will be able to use the “Pro” featured version of GameSalad Direct and publish “the old way” until your subscription ends. However, if you are an “Express” subscription holder, you will not be able to use certain features that are reserved solely for “Pro” subscription holders (specifically, iAds, custom splash screens and URL forwarding).
Chunkypixels asked: "Is publishing through Direct going to be the only option available, or can users have an option to still publish their own apps without having to go through Direct?"
We understand the concerns raised by members of this community and we're currently exploring options to address those concerns.
"What happens with Promo Codes?"
GameSalad will retain 10 promo codes per app for press reviews and marketing purposes. The other 40 will go straight to the developer.
"What improvements do current subscribers have access to until their accounts expire?"
Subscribers will get access to all GameSalad updates available under their subscription.
When you going to release this direct stuff?, we r dying here... waiting for it.
Is it a frame time that we should know...
...and with GameSalad Direct® I could test the iAds business model. If it works, then I can upgrade to Pro. I think a week is long enough to resolve this problem. Your reputation is getting killed out there. It's not good for business.
AND FIX THAT AVATAR, IT'S DEPRESSING!
It is pretty stupid that us express members STILL won't get iAds until our subscription expires.
So basically our games will be owned by GameSalad. GameSalad splash screen + GameSalad as the author = GS is the owner.
Once again, another yellow-post that contains close to no new information, just answered questions. Did I since fear in that yellow-post?
Thanks, but I won't use GameSalad for my apps/games. Time to move onto *censored*.
(That is me, Corona isn't censored)
@Photics:
"AND FIX THAT AVATAR, IT'S DEPRESSING!"
They must realize that "SS GameSalad" is sinking.
Obviously they are considering other options because the GameSalad Direct® only option will result in the loss of customers and damage the reputation of GameSalad.
I've been working on Annoyed Tomatoes and I don't think I could make a game like that with Corona or Unity, not with the speed I'm achieving. If you're going to use other software, then just go. I don't write letters to Coca-Cola informing them that I'm brushing my teeth and drinking water.
UPDATE: The GameSalad account avatar now has color, perhaps things will get better. It's proof that the GameSalad team is willing to make improvements based on community feedback.
Dr. Sam Beckett never returned home...
Twitter: https://twitter.com/Quantum_Sheep
Web: https://quantumsheep.itch.io
Dr. Sam Beckett never returned home...
Twitter: https://twitter.com/Quantum_Sheep
Web: https://quantumsheep.itch.io
They know there are options available, such as different memberships. "We want PRO back", "We don't want Direct", "Here's a solution". The C.O.O has read those posts, but doesn't want to admit the wrong doing GameSalad has done.
Their Timeline
Announcement ---> FAQ #1 ---> Mini FAQ ---> Another FAQ On The Way?
I also guess you haven't heard of opinion. You can't just automatically assume a post is bashing them.
*Gets on a "SS GameSalad" lifeboat*
The C.O.O stated, "I apologize for that mistake" in the first post of this thread. That's the first step to resolving this issue. The second is coming up with a solution that is good for business... one that makes customers and the GameSalad team happy.
I'm glad you're talking, and hopeful you'll come up with a hybrid solution (Direct option, Pro option) that makes good business sense for you as well as the diverse needs of your community of developers.
LOL
Not everybody is a FMG or TSB or Utopian (I mean this in a good way)
We are working hard and like I said before, getting better on each 'taptard'.
There's a market for everyone and since the App store is very unpredictable, who knows who/what will make the next hit.
I rather see something similar to Corona ~$499 per year with current express and pro available; I'm assuming there's more than 1000 GS users utilizing their software...that's about half a million bucks they can make easily and if the word spread, they could easily hit 10,000 users in the next couple of months.
On top of that, they could offer GS Direct for 'amateurs' that want to give it a try and taste the water on the app store without investing more than what GS takes.
This way, there IS an option to go up and down.
GS could keep being a software company while at the same time been introduce as a publisher.
Just a thought.
RD
I nearly bought it twice in the last couple of months and would have done if they could have guaranteed that pricing was not gonna change.