RH said: Conragts on the release! Do you know how well this runs on an old 3G?
I'm not entirely sure, but I think it should be playable. I tested BOT with an iPhone 4 and a Second Generation iPod Touch. I worked hard to make sure that the game would run on both devices.
AddictiveGames said: Photics will you be revealing rough sales numbers over the next week or are you keeping everything close to your chest?
I haven't decided. I realize that developers like to see that information, but I don't like to give that information out. I am seriously considering it. As of right now, I don't have that information anyway. There's nothing to report.
So far, and as expected, the promo codes that I sent out seem to have been wasted — except one. I'm not sure which review site actually decided to look at the game.
tshirtbooth said: I was not fond of the controls. Most of the time it was to slow turning around to kill the bad guy.
Maybe there's some confusion, as you control the speed of the turning.
Touch directly behind TANK, hold that touch, this is how you can aim and shoot. Hold the touch and spin around. You can see that TANK follows your movement.
Photics said: On the English and German versions of the App description, there are instructions on how to play.
You can get full health back at the repair shop.
Exactly! At first, you shouldn't wander too far from the base. You managed to kill some of the enemies. That's actually a good start.
I like how you stated, "so many ways to go" which I think is great. In our modern lives, it's a rarity to get lost. We have GPS and online maps. I think that's what adds to the adventure of BOT. There's danger and exploration.
It's good feedback though
I feel people read the 1st few lines then skip to the screenshots, i know for me anyway, i rarely read the full descriptions! This i reckon is the same for a lot of poeple, therefore, they're not going to know how to play and will they look back at the description? Nope, they'll look in game, see nothing and get frustrated! Thats my take on it anyway.
As for all the ways to go, i'd argue this isn't a good thing! Sure hardcore gamers might like it but the majority of the appstore is casual based, i dont think people will want the headache of 'where am i'. I could be wrong, again, all of this is just my take on it.
Is there more bases as the game goes on? To have to save at the base is outright annoying, if i've gone miles out, i dont wanna have to trawl back trying to figure out where base is! If you insist on the gold to save then i seriously recommend a fast track back to base. i.e. you go to menu and there is a button that takes you straight to base!
This is interesting feedback. One of the reasons I built BOT was because I felt the iTunes App Store is cluttered with too many casual and simplistic games. Some of the complaints are main features of the game...
It's too big? Wow, there are MMORPGs that might kill for such a comment.
Here's some game advice... Don't tap to shoot. It's not a tapping game. Hold the touch to shoot and aim.
Photics said: Did you read the instructions or just jump into the game?
By the sounds of it the only instructions are located in it's itunes description. This doesn't seem like such a good idea since very few people actually read those. (just my personal opinion)
BackUpAndDown said: By the sounds of it the only instructions are located in it's itunes description. This doesn't seem like such a good idea since very few people actually read those. (just my personal opinion)
People skip tutorials too though.
I think a tutorial is something that can be added.
uptimistik said: I don't think it's too big. But if it is that big, it needs something (storylines, hints etc) to keep you playing.
Gaming really has changed. In The Legend of Zelda, there was no tutorial - other than an item listing. We figured these things out. We played until we got good at the game. If there was something that we didn't understand, we asked around. In Orcania of Time, supposedly one of the greatest games ever, I hated the tutorial... I still hate that stupid owl.
tshirtbooth said: Photics, I know its your baby and you need to defend it. But many people are giving you great advice. You need to take that in and listed to your customers. I know you have in your head reasons for everything you did in your game, but when your customers tell you that they don't like these things it may be time to say ok maybe i was wrong.
I'm not against adding a tutorial. But right here and now, there's the developer explaining how to play. If people still hate it after knowing how to play, that's something else.
...and there's purpose to the exploration... finding the upgrades.
The hints? ...those big empty spaces on your equipment menu. ...the NPCs!
Also, this is a game with a lot of content, so it's not a game you blast through in five minutes.
tshirtbooth said: Photics, I know its your baby and you need to defend it. But many people are giving you great advice. You need to take that in and listed to your customers. I know you have in your head reasons for everything you did in your game, but when your customers tell you that they don't like these things it may be time to say ok maybe i was wrong.
+1 you have your visions and the way everything should be but its not about what you want, its about what they want. It doesnt matter if you hate tutorials, the fact that every person to comment that played so far asked for one, you should be working on that right away.
JohnPapiomitis said: +1 you have your visions and the way everything should be but its not about what you want, its about what they want. It doesnt matter if you hate tutorials, the fact that every person to comment that played so far asked for one, you should be working on that right away.
Even if I magically created a tutorial right now, it would still be days before Apple approved it.
tshirtbooth said: The problem is i did not find any upgrades in my 15 minutes of game play. Hell i did not even know there were upgrades to find.
This... this is my point... 15 minutes... instant gratification... this game is not that. It's more retro, when games were harder. If you're expecting to be a master after 10 minutes, this game is not that.
The game looks well crafted, but just not my cup of tea.
I did want to help with some brainstorming though. The problem seems to be how to give information to people who just want to dive in and play.
Maybe you could set up hints that are based on the location. They could be thought bubbles that fade away. They could be prizes given when a certain amount of money has been collected. Instructions could look like a HUD at the start and take several minutes to fade away. Maybe the HUD vanishes when the screen is pressed. Create ways to suggest there are more subtleties to the game controls.
uptimistik said: After playing some more, here are a few questions I should not be asking:
How do I get health? How do I save? What do I do/Where do I go?
This is in the instructions... you get your health back at the repair shop. That's the pulsing circle on the right. You'll see a pink bot. She's the one with the heart. If you watch, your health comes back when you visit her.
You save at the repair shop.
Where do you go? Roam around a bit until you can buy some better guns. It's exploring, you're supposed to get lost.
Press the Game Center icon on the equipment menu to activate the Game Center features.
You access the equipment menu by pressing the health bar.
tshirtbooth said: Photics its CLEAR you have no interest in the feedback we are offering. So i will stop now.
Good! You're not posting feedback. You're posting complaints after playing the game for like 10 seconds.
If the instructions are there, and players ignore them, there's not much I can do about that. Sure, I can add a tutorial to make things easier... and I'm thinking on how to do that... but this game is not for casual gamers that want nothing more than flinging birds at blocks.
Photics said: Even if I magically created a tutorial right now, it would still be days before Apple approved it.
This... this is my point... 15 minutes... instant gratification... this game is not that. It's more retro, when games were harder. If you're expecting to be a master after 10 minutes, this game is not that.
might take a couple days but the quicker you do it the quicker itll be there. Like i said i know you have your visions of your game, but if every person so far says the same thing it needs to be done. Every game ive ever done ive had to add stuff i neccesarily dont agree with but others want. The customers are the ones paying, there the ones that you gotta kinsider, not yourself. It just seems your a little to stuborn, you basically telling everyone in a nice way you dont give a crap about any of there suggestions. If thats what you want the customers to think go ahead, i just dont comprehend how you dont want to take suggestions and work on them. Best of luck either way
and again this isnt a console game. I know that you feel people that play for 10 min and give up arent giving it enough time, but to be honest your lucky to keep someones attention on the iphone for 10 mins
Photics, just purchased the game, and will review later this week after playing it!
One thing to keep in mind is that I think you have some tunnel vision when it comes to iOS apps. The iOS audience is a much different breed than console gamers like you and I. Therefore they need instruction... it's plain and simple, and it's the new breed of gamer.
JohnPapiomitis said: It just seems your a little to stuborn, you basically telling everyone in a nice way you dont give a crap about any of there suggestions. If thats what you want the customers to think go ahead, i just dont comprehend how you dont want to take suggestions and work on them. Best of luck either way
What are the suggestions...
1 - Add a tutorial. This makes sense... and I can't change that right now. My issue is that the developer is right here, explaining how to play. If players are still lost, that says, "Give up on BOT and build candy bar apps."
2 - Give more reason for exploration... if someone actually got an upgrade and still felt that way, then I can see this as justifiable feedback.
butterbean said: Photics, just purchased the game, and will review later this week after playing it!
That's cool.
butterbean said: The iOS audience is a much different breed than console gamers like you and I. Therefore they need instruction... it's plain and simple, and it's the new breed of gamer.
Yeah, I didn't think it was that bad... but wow... it's bad!
My issue is that the developer is right here, explaining how to play.
that has nothing to do with it man.You really think that people that dont come to the forum are gonna search find the forum and dig threw a 15 page thread to find info? Thats completly insane if you think that
again like butterbean said this ISNT a console game or something to compare to Wow. This is a iphone game. People arent gonna get excited buy your game, and then search the internet on tips or how to play like you would say halo or wow. 99 percent of people that buy ios apps, if you dont get there attention in a couple minutes theyll just delete the app
Im gonna stop now because i honestly think you don't care, but again best of luck with it
tshirtbooth said: You make us sit through a 14 page dialling of the progress of BOT yet you can't take the feedback from the people that was curious enough to buy your game
Would you accept a review of World of Warcraft after the reviewer played it like 10 minutes?
I'm explaining how to play the game. I get the part about the tutorial. I don't see what else I'm missing.
Players dying? There's not enough feedback for me to know for sure just yet. If everyone is dropping dead, then I made the game too hard. I can add other ways to get health.
...but if people figure out how to play... and they're not dropping dead, then I've made the game too easy.
The overall feedback seems to be...
1 - The game is hard. I don't see that as a bad thing. If I make it too easy, I defeat the purpose of the app. 2 - No reason to explore? I'm not sure why this is. I see reason for players to go wander around. People don't seem to be getting that though.
Dizko said: Photics, your attitude is hilarious, I must say. This quasi-flame war has provided a good deal of entertainment this morning.
Ha ha... well... that is the ultimate objective for an entertainment app. Unfortunately, it's entertaining for the wrong reasons
There is something wrong, as only one person has been able to submit a score. Either it's too early for people to play... no one is playing... or they don't know how to submit their score.
...get an upgrade? ...buy a better gun? ...submit a score to Game Center? ...finish a quest?
I am sorry for the attitude, but yours is amazin...
The same could be said for Angry Birds. What's the point of hurling yourself into a block? I at least played the game to figure out what the hype was about. With this game, it seems like players stumbled on the controls because they didn't read the instructions. Then, they died a few times and gave up.
That's a first impression. There's no recovery from that. It's highly unlikely that I can add a tutorial later and Tshirtbooth is going to be all like, "Dude, I got 1st on survivor!"
That was the risk in making a game for hardcore / console players. I don't expect every player to love the game. I didn't expect this either though. HA.
1. Tutorial. 2. Save at any given time. 3. Put health around. Having to go back to base after getting 'lost'/exploring, whatever you wish to call it, is just crazy! 4. Story/Dialogue. The hardcore gamers can roam until their hearts are content, the most basic of user should have main missions to complete.
I think you have tried to be too clever and have also become too submerged into your own game. You know where you are supposed to go, you know where upgrades are, you know EVERYTHING ... we ... well ... we know nothing! Its the BOT loading screen and thats it, POW, you're in the game. For me, as an end user, how am I supposed to know whats going on and what im supposed to do. It just starts with NOTHING!
I get in your head, you have reasoned everything out but this is great feedback from everyone, dont take it as neggy, its constructive, all of it has been. It does feel like you are defending your decisions, with 15 pages i think we know your reasoning, but many of us are just telling you, it simply doesnt work in captivating the audience.
Im sure it does with time and practise, but im deeply afraid on iOS ... you dont get time! If they were paying $40 then maybe they would give it time, for $0.99, not a chance, they'll just dismiss it as rubbish and move on.
Comments
A new player finally appeared on Game Center
Photics will you be revealing rough sales numbers over the next week or are you keeping everything close to your chest?
So far, and as expected, the promo codes that I sent out seem to have been wasted — except one. I'm not sure which review site actually decided to look at the game.
Touch directly behind TANK, hold that touch, this is how you can aim and shoot. Hold the touch and spin around. You can see that TANK follows your movement.
It does take some practice.
Maybe the game needs a tutorial.
The reason to explore the world is because there are power ups there... and quests to complete... and gold from the enemies.
As for all the ways to go, i'd argue this isn't a good thing! Sure hardcore gamers might like it but the majority of the appstore is casual based, i dont think people will want the headache of 'where am i'. I could be wrong, again, all of this is just my take on it.
Is there more bases as the game goes on? To have to save at the base is outright annoying, if i've gone miles out, i dont wanna have to trawl back trying to figure out where base is! If you insist on the gold to save then i seriously recommend a fast track back to base. i.e. you go to menu and there is a button that takes you straight to base!
It's too big? Wow, there are MMORPGs that might kill for such a comment.
Here's some game advice...
Don't tap to shoot. It's not a tapping game. Hold the touch to shoot and aim.
I think a tutorial is something that can be added.
...and there's purpose to the exploration... finding the upgrades.
The hints?
...those big empty spaces on your equipment menu.
...the NPCs!
Also, this is a game with a lot of content, so it's not a game you blast through in five minutes.
I did want to help with some brainstorming though.
The problem seems to be how to give information to people who just want to dive in and play.
Maybe you could set up hints that are based on the location. They could be thought bubbles that fade away.
They could be prizes given when a certain amount of money has been collected. Instructions could look like a HUD at the start and take several minutes to fade away. Maybe the HUD vanishes when the screen is pressed. Create ways to suggest there are more subtleties to the game controls.
Cheers
You save at the repair shop.
Where do you go? Roam around a bit until you can buy some better guns. It's exploring, you're supposed to get lost.
Press the Game Center icon on the equipment menu to activate the Game Center features.
You access the equipment menu by pressing the health bar.
If the instructions are there, and players ignore them, there's not much I can do about that. Sure, I can add a tutorial to make things easier... and I'm thinking on how to do that... but this game is not for casual gamers that want nothing more than flinging birds at blocks.
and again this isnt a console game. I know that you feel people that play for 10 min and give up arent giving it enough time, but to be honest your lucky to keep someones attention on the iphone for 10 mins
One thing to keep in mind is that I think you have some tunnel vision when it comes to iOS apps. The iOS audience is a much different breed than console gamers like you and I. Therefore they need instruction... it's plain and simple, and it's the new breed of gamer.
1 - Add a tutorial. This makes sense... and I can't change that right now. My issue is that the developer is right here, explaining how to play. If players are still lost, that says, "Give up on BOT and build candy bar apps."
2 - Give more reason for exploration... if someone actually got an upgrade and still felt that way, then I can see this as justifiable feedback.
again like butterbean said this ISNT a console game or something to compare to Wow. This is a iphone game. People arent gonna get excited buy your game, and then search the internet on tips or how to play like you would say halo or wow. 99 percent of people that buy ios apps, if you dont get there attention in a couple minutes theyll just delete the app
Im gonna stop now because i honestly think you don't care, but again best of luck with it
I'm explaining how to play the game. I get the part about the tutorial. I don't see what else I'm missing.
Players dying? There's not enough feedback for me to know for sure just yet. If everyone is dropping dead, then I made the game too hard. I can add other ways to get health.
...but if people figure out how to play... and they're not dropping dead, then I've made the game too easy.
The overall feedback seems to be...
1 - The game is hard. I don't see that as a bad thing. If I make it too easy, I defeat the purpose of the app.
2 - No reason to explore? I'm not sure why this is. I see reason for players to go wander around. People don't seem to be getting that though.
...get an upgrade?
...buy a better gun?
...submit a score to Game Center?
...finish a quest?
There is something wrong, as only one person has been able to submit a score. Either it's too early for people to play... no one is playing... or they don't know how to submit their score.
That's a first impression. There's no recovery from that. It's highly unlikely that I can add a tutorial later and Tshirtbooth is going to be all like, "Dude, I got 1st on survivor!"
That was the risk in making a game for hardcore / console players. I don't expect every player to love the game. I didn't expect this either though. HA.
1. Tutorial.
2. Save at any given time.
3. Put health around. Having to go back to base after getting 'lost'/exploring, whatever you wish to call it, is just crazy!
4. Story/Dialogue. The hardcore gamers can roam until their hearts are content, the most basic of user should have main missions to complete.
I think you have tried to be too clever and have also become too submerged into your own game. You know where you are supposed to go, you know where upgrades are, you know EVERYTHING ... we ... well ... we know nothing! Its the BOT loading screen and thats it, POW, you're in the game. For me, as an end user, how am I supposed to know whats going on and what im supposed to do. It just starts with NOTHING!
I get in your head, you have reasoned everything out but this is great feedback from everyone, dont take it as neggy, its constructive, all of it has been. It does feel like you are defending your decisions, with 15 pages i think we know your reasoning, but many of us are just telling you, it simply doesnt work in captivating the audience.
Im sure it does with time and practise, but im deeply afraid on iOS ... you dont get time! If they were paying $40 then maybe they would give it time, for $0.99, not a chance, they'll just dismiss it as rubbish and move on.