Chunkypixels said: Theres always going to be a handful of games that go against this, and strive for quality, but they really will be few and far between.
quantumsheep said: You'd be paying twice, no matter what. But this new system would require you to move your games over to GS and have them as your publisher.
Your basically going to be left with 3 options:
1) leave your apps on the store, and never be able to update them 2) move them over to Direct, and have them become GS published 3) remove them from the appstore, maybe rewrite them with new software
Its actually quite a cunning way to force succesful games into the GS fold, especially if the developer really doesnt want to learn any new software. Lets face it, most devs will only continue to update and support products that are making money.... so those will be the ones that the new policy is obviously aimed at getting across to the new system....
Hopefully this is just a "brief" overview to clarify the recent news, and more details and changes will be coming soon. I don't think that a lot of us can accept this as the final answer, so fingers, toes, AND eyes crossed that Gamesalad has heard it's loyal users opinions, and will make changes accordingly.
tshirtbooth said: Hey i have been ok with this so far But ... I DO NOT LIKE THIS PART! ....
"Your games stay on the App Store. You are free to continue to update your games for the rest of your existing subscription term. Once your subscription expires, you’ll be able to move your games over to GameSalad Direct."
Im sorry but those games were made with a package i bought and paid for. So i cant update those games with out giving them to you after my membership expires? Thats like getting paid twice if you ask me .
You guys know im a GS fanboy but this upsets me.
this is my 2nd biggest problem with this new system. First being I just want to do everything myself.
Chunkypixels said: Your basically going to be left with 3 options:
1) leave your apps on the store, and never be able to update them 2) move them over to Direct, and have them become GS published 3) remove them from the appstore, maybe rewrite them with new software
Its actually quite a cunning way to force succesful games into the GS fold, especially if the developer really doesnt want to learn any new software. Lets face it, most devs will only continue to update and support products that are making money.... so those will be the ones that the new policy is obviously aimed at getting across to the new system....
I hear you, and the options you present seem accurate!
The thing is... if you move a game across from one account to another... well... I don't think you actually can.
The guy who wrote Vector Tank wanted to publish the game under his own name after his publishing deal expired.
He couldn't do it. Everyone that had bought Vector Tank under the publishing deal would have to buy the game AGAIN (under the guy's own name) if they wanted to get further updates.
He was essentially offering the same game, but because it was being published by a different entity, it became a 'new version' that previous owners couldn't update.
So unless there's some new magic system in place, or Apple has relaxed this ruling, your customers from BEFORE GSDirect would not be able to update when you move your game across.
I'm tired. It's gone 3:30am. I'm not being very coherent and I apologise if what I'm writing doesn't make sense.
tshirtbooth said: Hey i have been ok with this so far But ... I DO NOT LIKE THIS PART! ....
"Your games stay on the App Store. You are free to continue to update your games for the rest of your existing subscription term. Once your subscription expires, you’ll be able to move your games over to GameSalad Direct."
Im sorry but those games were made with a package i bought and paid for. So i cant update those games with out giving them to you after my membership expires? Thats like getting paid twice if you ask me .
You guys know im a GS fanboy but this upsets me.
I read that and had the exact same feelings... so for anyone that has a successful game at the moment, once your membership expires you will be giving your success to the people over there in the GS offices. I'm sure they enjoyed charging you $99/$2000 for your membership and now their just waiting for that additional percent to kick in.. Best of all they will be making money on games that were not even published with this "BS" direct.. Genius business strategy.
Let's face it they aren't going to change anything that will benefit us. They will try to make it look like we are getting a better % and later screw us. Like I said , I'll finish my 2.5 months and that's it I'm already looking into the other options. You people here on the forum are great and it's sad to see us all get screwed. I will no longer comment on this nonsense that GS is pulling. I'll still comment on other topics and competitor forums all the while hoping GS gets their heads out of their stink hole.
I remember posting how much someone would loose with this new system, and guess what? It got deleted.
What I posted:
"I'm gonna point this out one last time (hopefully), and hope people listen..
Game Sales: $100 (not likely, but possible) After Apple: $70 After GS: $51 (assuming GS's cut will be 30%)
After Per-Publish Fee of $25: $26 After Per-Publish Fee of $50: $1.00 Any Per-Publish Fee Above $51: Your broke.
=====EDIT I should also add per-update fees as well. If an update counts as a publish, then I guess your broke both ways. =====END EDIT
So, after all the cuts and fees, you would have made less than 45% of your sales.
Now, I have a question for you: would you like seeing $70, or the amounts described? I hope people will see the light."
Now the C.O.O's post basically confirms a publish fee AND revenue share. I'm also upset that this forum is closing posts that compare two different software. Comparing is in no way promoting. Promoting is advertising.
Bye GameSalad Product. (I'm staying with the community though)
iDeveloper said: "When you publish through GameSalad Direct, you will still be able to brand your game uniquely to you. We do not want to interfere with your reputation or growth as a developer." Ummm... HOW exactly????? If we're publishing through your iTunes Connect account, then the author of our games will be "GameSalad"..... I don't want that.
Yeah, that's also my biggest concern. I'd be willing to pay a little more, like a Pro Publishing Service, if you could offer that? Assuming that's even possible with this business model?
Guys i think you r doing a storm in a glass of water... Lets wait and see the options they going to give us an stop speculating about it...
iDeveloper said: I remember posting how much someone would loose with this new system, and guess what? It got deleted.
What I posted:
"I'm gonna point this out one last time (hopefully), and hope people listen..
Game Sales: $100 (not likely, but possible) After Apple: $70 After GS: $51 (assuming GS's cut will be 30%)
After Per-Publish Fee of $25: $26 After Per-Publish Fee of $50: $1.00 Any Per-Publish Fee Above $51: Your broke.
=====EDIT I should also add per-update fees as well. If an update counts as a publish, then I guess your broke both ways. =====END EDIT
Did you really think that's going to happen... I mean, we r not stupid and if they said already its going to be right for the developer i dont think we going to get to those stupid math calculations you mention cause then they going to loose every buddy and thats not an idea for any company... They want to make money so if they put all those fees and !@#$% they going to run out of developers... I Know I'm new in this but, just think about it...
1) Taxes and VAT? For example, will you be 1099'ing USA residents? 2) You will need our social security or EID numbers, how will you secure that data 3) How do you handle paying people in various money (Dollars, Euro, Yen, etc)
Apple handles many details for selling overseas, taxes, bank exchange rates, direct deposits, sales taxes, etc. You going to handle sales taxes?
PS: To non Gendai posters, I want official answers, no point in speculation. How the financial and personal data is handled is a huge thing.
Player_E said: I read that and had the exact same feelings... so for anyone that has a successful game at the moment, once your membership expires you will be giving your success to the people over there in the GS offices. I'm sure they enjoyed charging you $99/$2000 for your membership and now their just waiting for that additional percent to kick in.. Best of all they will be making money on games that were not even published with this "BS" direct.. Genius business strategy.
The majority of PRO owners paid only $500, not 2K.
TymeMaster said: There is a ton of stuff unanswered:
1) Taxes and VAT? For example, will you be 1099'ing USA residents? 2) You will need our social security or EID numbers, how will you secure that data 3) How do you handle paying people in various money (Dollars, Euro, Yen, etc)
Apple handles many details for selling overseas, taxes, bank exchange rates, direct deposits, sales taxes, etc. You going to handle sales taxes?
PS: To non Gendai posters, I want official answers, no point in speculation. How the financial and personal data is handled is a huge thing.
#2 Is another reason I don't want to be a part of GameSalad Direct. If this company can't communicate very good, then what about securing Social Security Numbers? I see legal trouble with GameSalad in the future because of possible misplaced SSN's.
BackUpAndDown said: I still think it's Bs that we have to pay an uploading fee AND split a percentage of the revenue with Gs... I can understand the revenue split, Gs needs an on going income to operate, but making the user pay to upload a game? Gendai is going to lose a lot of professional and hobbyist developers if they keep tacking on all these costs.
Exactly. I don't think I'm comfortable with having to pay money just to publish my games. Gendai is basically charging us twice, first just to publish in the first place, then they take a portion of the money we make.
tshirtbooth said: Hey i have been ok with this so far But ... I DO NOT LIKE THIS PART! ....
"Your games stay on the App Store. You are free to continue to update your games for the rest of your existing subscription term. Once your subscription expires, you’ll be able to move your games over to GameSalad Direct."
Im sorry but those games were made with a package i bought and paid for. So i cant update those games with out giving them to you after my membership expires? Thats like getting paid twice if you ask me .
You guys know im a GS fanboy but this upsets me.
Your right T-Shirt this is JUST GETTING WORSE AND WORSE. I am so upset at GameSalad right now. I just can't believe what they are doing. Now I won't be able to update my past apps unless I go direct? That sir is a BIG GIANT BUNCH OF B.S.!
I will admit that if I was a complete newbie this new system would be great but now that I have my Apple Developers account and have been publishing apps myself I just can't go back. This is the way I want to do things and run my business. I am NOT going to have GameSalad be my publisher. NO WAY NO HOW! They need to have other options. PERIOD. It is the only right thing for them to do. Have your GameSalad Direct and have other options!
Arghhhhhhhhhhhhhh! I can't believe this. They just keep digging themselves in a deeper hole with their current users.
Your games stay on the App Store. You are free to continue to update your games for the rest of your existing subscription term. Once your subscription expires, you’ll be able to move your games over to GameSalad Direct.
It is not possible to "move [our] games over to GameSalad Direct".
Why you ask?
Apple does not allow the transfer of apps between iTunes accounts.
We would have to delete our apps off of our iTunes accounts and re-publish them under GameSalad.
The problem with that is every single user who purchased our apps would have to re-purchase the apps under their new publisher.
Can everyone please spread this message so that GameSalad will see it? Heck, copy & paste this post if you'd like!
tripleehentertainment said: It is not possible to "move [our] games over to GameSalad Direct".
Why you ask?
Apple does not allow the transfer of apps between iTunes accounts.
We would have to delete our apps off of our iTunes accounts and re-publish them under GameSalad.
The problem with that is every single user who purchased our apps would have to re-purchase the apps under their new publisher.
Can everyone please spread this message so that GameSalad will see it? Heck, copy & paste this post if you'd like!
You really don't need to post this in EVERY thread AND start a new topic on it. This point has been brought up several times before. Same answer... no one knows what's happening yet... GS may have deals with Apple in play... WISH THEY'D TELL US!
I take that as an encouraging sign. His background is more along the lines of what GS needs in order to straighten this out. I was actually unsure whether they had any management in place until I read an interview with the CEO a couple of days ago (that's not meant as an insult, I just didn't know). Also, the tone of the FAQ shows a little more thought, although still lacking in certain areas for some people apparently.
GameSalad said: If your subscription has recently expired or is about to expire, contact customer support and we’ll work with you to make sure you have an extension until we launch GameSalad Direct.
This makes it sound like we still have a month or two before it'll be released... Anyone else agree?
It took all week to compile this? There are no answers here.
.. and I found this part most puzzling. "They key benefit of this pricing model is that it allows more people to try their hand at making games because the tool is free, but also encourages quality."
How do you figure? (and it's not even worded in proper English.)
From the fact they are saying the % is favourable especially for successful games, does that mean they will be reviewing games and deciding on a % or waiting for a game to take off and then changing %.
It could be a way to cut the crap, if they review and say we want 30% people may not publish, but if its a good game and they offer to take 15% it's more likely somebody would publish the game.
I think the % should be based on the quality of the game. Higher quality apps should be charged a lower % to encourage users to put more effort into what they publish.
TymeMaster said: There is a ton of stuff unanswered:
1) Taxes and VAT? For example, will you be 1099'ing USA residents? 2) You will need our social security or EID numbers, how will you secure that data 3) How do you handle paying people in various money (Dollars, Euro, Yen, etc)
Apple handles many details for selling overseas, taxes, bank exchange rates, direct deposits, sales taxes, etc. You going to handle sales taxes?
PS: To non Gendai posters, I want official answers, no point in speculation. How the financial and personal data is handled is a huge thing.
Or they could always force us to use paypal, which would mean other % stolen from us.
Comments
Thanks for clearing up all the facts we already know.
Breakthrough information here? They won't steal more than 49.9% of your profits.
Congrats GS users. What a win for the huddled masses.
/sarcasm
Edit: I sure hope this isn't the response FAQ we've been waiting for.
1) leave your apps on the store, and never be able to update them
2) move them over to Direct, and have them become GS published
3) remove them from the appstore, maybe rewrite them with new software
Its actually quite a cunning way to force succesful games into the GS fold, especially if the developer really doesnt want to learn any new software. Lets face it, most devs will only continue to update and support products that are making money.... so those will be the ones that the new policy is obviously aimed at getting across to the new system....
Send and Receive Data using your own Server Tutorial! | Vote for A Long Way Home on Steam Greenlight! | Ten Years Left
The thing is... if you move a game across from one account to another... well... I don't think you actually can.
The guy who wrote Vector Tank wanted to publish the game under his own name after his publishing deal expired.
He couldn't do it. Everyone that had bought Vector Tank under the publishing deal would have to buy the game AGAIN (under the guy's own name) if they wanted to get further updates.
He was essentially offering the same game, but because it was being published by a different entity, it became a 'new version' that previous owners couldn't update.
So unless there's some new magic system in place, or Apple has relaxed this ruling, your customers from BEFORE GSDirect would not be able to update when you move your game across.
I'm tired. It's gone 3:30am. I'm not being very coherent and I apologise if what I'm writing doesn't make sense.
Anyway, this seems somewhat appropriate:
Especially the last two sentences!
QS
Dr. Sam Beckett never returned home...
Twitter: https://twitter.com/Quantum_Sheep
Web: https://quantumsheep.itch.io
What I posted:
"I'm gonna point this out one last time (hopefully), and hope people listen..
Game Sales: $100 (not likely, but possible)
After Apple: $70
After GS: $51 (assuming GS's cut will be 30%)
After Per-Publish Fee of $25: $26
After Per-Publish Fee of $50: $1.00
Any Per-Publish Fee Above $51: Your broke.
=====EDIT
I should also add per-update fees as well. If an update counts as a publish, then I guess your broke both ways.
=====END EDIT
So, after all the cuts and fees, you would have made less than 45% of your sales.
Now, I have a question for you: would you like seeing $70, or the amounts described? I hope people will see the light."
Now the C.O.O's post basically confirms a publish fee AND revenue share. I'm also upset that this forum is closing posts that compare two different software. Comparing is in no way promoting. Promoting is advertising.
Bye GameSalad Product. (I'm staying with the community though)
Thanks for the FAQ!
Twitter:rondorocket
Web: rondorocket.com
1) Taxes and VAT? For example, will you be 1099'ing USA residents?
2) You will need our social security or EID numbers, how will you secure that data
3) How do you handle paying people in various money (Dollars, Euro, Yen, etc)
Apple handles many details for selling overseas, taxes, bank exchange rates, direct deposits, sales taxes, etc. You going to handle sales taxes?
PS: To non Gendai posters, I want official answers, no point in speculation. How the financial and personal data is handled is a huge thing.
With no disrespect to Mr. Coppersmith! :-)
-JOsh
I will admit that if I was a complete newbie this new system would be great but now that I have my Apple Developers account and have been publishing apps myself I just can't go back. This is the way I want to do things and run my business. I am NOT going to have GameSalad be my publisher. NO WAY NO HOW! They need to have other options. PERIOD. It is the only right thing for them to do. Have your GameSalad Direct and have other options!
Arghhhhhhhhhhhhhh! I can't believe this. They just keep digging themselves in a deeper hole with their current users.
http://www.linkedin.com/in/frankcoppersmith
Why you ask?
Apple does not allow the transfer of apps between iTunes accounts.
We would have to delete our apps off of our iTunes accounts and re-publish them under GameSalad.
The problem with that is every single user who purchased our apps would have to re-purchase the apps under their new publisher.
Can everyone please spread this message so that GameSalad will see it?
Heck, copy & paste this post if you'd like!
Twitter:rondorocket
Web: rondorocket.com
It took all week to compile this? There are no answers here.
.. and I found this part most puzzling.
"They key benefit of this pricing model is that it allows more people to try their hand at making games because the tool is free, but also encourages quality."
How do you figure? (and it's not even worded in proper English.)
It could be a way to cut the crap, if they review and say we want 30% people may not publish, but if its a good game and they offer to take 15% it's more likely somebody would publish the game.