BackUpAndDown said: I think the % should be based on the quality of the game. Higher quality apps should be charged a lower % to encourage users to put more effort into what they publish.
That's not a silly idea... but who decides? Could cause all kinds of fights "my app is better than yours, why do I have to pay more?" LOL.
OK, here is the deal. I know many of you use GS to make your own games. And because of this you are upset at the possibility of what the Direct program might mean, and I can understand why. But in my case I don't use GS to make games for myself, instead I use GS to make apps for other companies. If Direct takes away my ability create apps the other companies can then publish them selves, then there is just now way I can continue using GS!
It's not like I am just being grumpy about some kind of new revenue sharing deal these guys are cooking up and I just want to boycott GS and Direct. If I can't use GS to create apps that companies can publish under their own terms then the guys here at GS leave me with nothing!
GUY AT GAMESALAD, if I can't continue using your tools to make apps for other companies, then where the heck are you leaving me????
Is anyone else like me out their, and uses GameSalad to make apps for other companies??
OK, here is the deal. I know many of you use GS to make your own games. And because of this you are upset at the possibility of what the Direct program might mean, and I can understand why. But in my case I don't use GS to make games for myself, instead I use GS to make apps for other companies. If Direct takes away my ability create apps the other companies can then publish them selves, then there is just now way I can continue using GS!
It's not like I am just being grumpy about some kind of new revenue sharing deal these guys are cooking up and I just want to boycott GS and Direct. If I can't use GS to create apps that companies can publish under their own terms then the guys here at GS leave me with nothing!
GAMESALAD, if I can't continue using your tools to make apps for other companies that where the heck or you leaving me????
Is anyone else like me out their, and uses GameSalad to make apps for other companies??
This is why they should still retain the "pro" version.
POLYGAMe said: This is why they should still retain the "pro" version.
Yes exactly, with out some kind of pro option then how can someone use GS as a tool for work? It would be like as if Adobe said to me one day,
"OK you can still use Photoshop to work as a graphic designer, but from now on you have to pass every image you make through us. And one more thing, we want to publish all your design work through us"
If that happened, I would have to drop Photoshop as a tool right away. You could be the best tool in the world! But if you don't give us designers a pro option, how can we use it???
Well this kinda confirms that I shan't be doing much more with GS. Unable to update games without moving to direct service after subscription expires? What a bag of s**t.
Couple that with the fact that I don't reckon users on subscriptions will get any updates past 0.8.9 either and this is all crap for us. (perhaps we'll get the next beta as its been in development a while, but that'll be it).
Then again the two kinda add up together don't they, you won't even be able to add new features to older games anyway.
I feel your pain! I just read the new letter. Are you like me and make apps for other companies? I just can't believe that GameSalad would no longer allow me to develop Apps for other companies with out forcing me to publish through them. There is now way I could use GS professionally if there isn't a pro option,
You claim you guys are listening but clearly are not! You're top users like tshirt, QS, FMP etc told you all for a month that they didnt want a publisher, they wanted to be able to be an indie dev and you went ahead anyway. You then announce it to the community and 95% of it say the same, you leave a good 4 days to come out with this FAQ, which says nothing new really and could of been done on day 1 of the announcement and stopped the massive thread, and you seemed again, to have not offered anything to help everyones concern. You really should have direct but offer some kind of pro or fee to have the game as your own. If you guys were listening, im sure you could reach a way of pleasing your community. You have something special here, please dont ruin it
beefy_clyro said: You claim you guys are listening but clearly are not! You're top users like tshirt, QS, FMP etc told you all for a month that they didnt want a publisher, they wanted to be able to be an indie dev and you went ahead anyway. You then announce it to the community and 95% of it say the same, you leave a good 4 days to come out with this FAQ, which says nothing new really and could of been done on day 1 of the announcement and stopped the massive thread, and you seemed again, to have not offered anything to help everyones concern. You really should have direct but offer some kind of pro or fee to have the game as your own. If you guys were listening, im sure you could reach a way of pleasing your community. You have something special here, please dont ruin it
beefy_clyro, so I am correct in assuming that there is no kind of pro? That I can no longer use GS as a tool for my work, because I am now forced to publish everything with the GS company? This will destroy any possibility of me using GS for my clients.
POLYGAMe said: That's not a silly idea... but who decides? Could cause all kinds of fights "my app is better than yours, why do I have to pay more?" LOL.
It could be an automated system that adjusts the % based on how many it sells.
beefy_clyro said: You have something special here, please dont ruin it
Each day more users switch to Corona and more reviews show up around the internet saying how lame GS has become. It's no longer a matter of "ruining it" but a matter of how many more days before they release Direct and put a stop to all this craziness. Unless they release some new solid information soon it will be to late.
For months and even years GameSalad will have to work to reverse all the negative reviews, tweets and feelings towards Gendai that pop up each day... it will not be an easy task, especially if they plan on waiting another week.
Ok this is the last thing I am going to say tonight or at this point I should say this morning...
I use Photoshop as professional graphic designer because it's the best tool for the job. I use Pro Tools as a musician because it's the best tool for the job. I use Maya as a 3D artist because it's the best tool for the job.
But if any of the companies that make those tools forced me to publish my professional work through them, then I would be forced to use other tools that let me be a free professional!
GameSalad, don't be stupid! killing a pro option that enables people to do the work that I do for other companies, kills any hope of your tool being considered a professional design tool.
Well... I was silence all this time (Not even sure anybody listens..) Will talk now..
You should think twice before doing something. There are a lot of users who are NOT in US. And NOT publishing games for US or NOT even in English. So "We'll be able to provide additional support, whether that support is marketing or otherwise, to help the game obtain even greater success." part becomes a lie... How will you market the app in different countries when you don't even know which language is talked there?
Situation is: Even I'm on top of few categories in my countries AppStore, I still get a LITTLE amount of sales per day. Some of my #1 apps in categories like Lifestyle makes only 100-150$ in a month. But I still want to stay in my countries AppStore. With making 7-8 apps like that, I'm earning more, but, with QUANTITY (With making more apps, and earning a little wtih every single one). That is how it SHOULD be in here. The reason is, the credit-card users in iTunes in my country are really a minority. Even if you sell your app to all of the users (Which is impossible) you would still not earn that much. That is why, I should publish more and more apps to get every one individually get sold in similarly few units as my other apps. So if I would pay that damn "Per-Publish Fee" for every app, my business becomes non-logical and non-profitable. I'm okay with revenue share (By saying I'm okay, I mean that's better than coding, I hate it but I accept it.) but if "Publishing Fee" happens, I'm out. And I will take as much as I can froum you as I leave. Because if you hit us, WE hit you back. So with users like TshirtBooth or FireMapleGames this fee may not be a problem, may not seem like a lot, but, who can guarantee anyone can make "Per-Publish Fee" and continue to earn and start profiting? (As long as Fee is not 5$. )
You always seem you care about the community, and seem like you are always sensitive about us etc. etc. But now if anyone asks, I would say, you are just trying to earn more money, which is normally a good thing, but with messing up the current paid users, not cool.... You are like any of us. You made an app, you placed it in the AppStore, sold it, and now getting really bad reviews and feedback. What would any of us do? We would give up the new idea or CHANGE it according to the paid users. And I think what you are doing is something like this: Consider I'm a super-duper talented graphic artist. And I can make this look like this. But I suck at making games. So I make a crappy game but make incredible graphics and screenshots. So game gets noticed and gets sold. But almost NONE of the users likes the game. Some of them hates it. But the game still continues to sell just for good screenshots. Just because costumers think it is a good game. Is it ethical for me to keep selling it?
GameSalad said: Also, we are introducing an App specifically for testing called the “GameSalad Player” that will be available through the App Store.
Will we be able to have betatesters with this? Will we be able to send preview builds to gamers sites with this? Will we be able to enter contests with this?
I do get the impression that this FAQ only answers the questions we already knew the answers to as they know the answers are all bad.
Such as:
- Whether old subscription members will be allowed to use new versions of GS **This is a biggie** - The excellent point about languages above (are gendai pretty good at chinese or arabic submission?) - The fact pros are now completely cut out (no you can't create apps for other companies now) - Whether they are reviewing apps based on quality before submission to apple - How they deal with tax - How they can be trusted to handle monthly payments - How does it work with contracts to apple for sales (kinda obvious really, they sign em and we are their family friendly forum) - The fact that apple don't allow withdrawn apps to be rereleased by new companies with the same game name (as they suggest to do after your subscription expires). - Whether apple are happy that someone operates a sub-store within their store
Because, as far as I can see, what just happened was a yellow post (and an email) repeating the EXACT same thing that was said previously in a shorter post.
You said you wanted to address the biggest concerns, so address them. Don't repeat the same damn thing that has everyone so angry, so sad and so worried.
We want to know one thing, I believe, above all else;
Is there any chance we will have an option besides using you as our "publisher"?
Also, how exactly will you be handling the GST on your end for Australians and (I think, I'm not really that knowledgeable about Canada) Canada?
This feels like it's really going to complicate tax time; and in Australia when using an ABN and charging GST, it's complex enough already.
I'm especially curious about Gendai's response to one in particular, and have some questions for their COO, Mr. Coppersmith:
Since you have customers worldwide, will GameSalad Direct enable us to publish to any iTunes app store of our choice?
Can we publish to several countries at the same time?
Will there be a per-country publishing fee?
Will you have the means to receive payment from Apple in the currency of those countries, so there is no conversion fee to US funds, then another conversion back to local funds when you pay us our remaining percentage?
Even if you don't currently have a corporate presence in all the countries where there are App Stores so that you can publish games, then receive and distribute funds to customers in those countries, do you plan to do so? If so, do you have a timeline you can share with us? If not, what are your plans?
Perhaps I'm naive about dealing with multiple app stores in multiple countries with multiple currencies, and this is all quite simple.
Another point, on the publishing through Direct business that hasnt been brought up is the added delay to actually seeing your payments.
Ive yet to see a corporate business that pays its users immediately. So Gendai/GameSalad will have to wait as usual for payments from Apple, and then they'll have their own additional schedule for paying out moneys owed to developers, that no doubt, will have an inbuilt period long enough to generate some additional interest on the funds in their account before they release them.
DigiCreator said: Is anyone else like me out their, and uses GameSalad to make apps for other companies??
Exactly the same situation. We bought pro membership just to make one promotional game app. I've made a couple personal games in the mean time just for fun, but we've been working on a new client app (not a game exactly) for a few months and buidling with GS. After days of not knowing what's going on with GS, we have made the decision to start rebuilding in Flash. Thank God Apple turned around on Flash a few weeks back!
I've enjoyed working with GS. I'd like to keep working with GS, but if Direct is the only option, that will not happen. At this point, I'm not sure the boss would be interested now even if they did keep some sort of Pro (independent) option.
What a train-wreck. Forcing all the previously published apps over to GS:Direct else not allowing people to update them? I hope Apple change their developer TOS just to disable the sort of craziness that GS are attempting.
Disappointed. Thanks for taking the time out to write something, though the questions still remain.
design219 said: Exactly the same situation. We bought pro membership just to make one promotional game app. I've made a couple personal games in the mean time just for fun, but we've been working on a new client app (not a game exactly) for a few months and buidling with GS. After days of not knowing what's going on with GS, we have made the decision to start rebuilding in Flash. Thank God Apple turned around on Flash a few weeks back!
I've enjoyed working with GS. I'd like to keep working with GS, but if Direct is the only option, that will not happen. At this point, I'm not sure the boss would be interested now even if they did keep some sort of Pro (independent) option.
I think a lot of people are currently in a similar situation, and the longer the delay from GameSalad on sorting it all out, the more users are going to be forced into making the decision to switch over to alternative software, as theyre simply unable to continue spending time and resources on waiting for something that to all intents and purposes is telling us that its going to be unusable for purpose in a few months down the line.
For me, Ive got a project that Ive been working on since March... mostly in my spare time between contracts, but its still a couple of months worth of work. Im about 80% complete. By the time its finished, I'll only have 3 months left on my Express account, and so wont have long to do updates before the license expires and Im forced to take up Direct or leave.
One of my regular clients is interested in the game, and has suggested I stop work on the GS version, and let them rewrite it in code, where they can add Plus+ and Gamecentre, and cross promote it from their other popular products. I really wanted to finish the game and release it under my own name, but the new GS direction is forcing my hand and making me question if theres really any point in even finishing my current products with their software, let alone any future ones. If Im going to be forced into a co-publishing deal, then I'd prefer to at least be able to choose who my partner is going to be.
I was waiting for the next update of GameSalad to help decide if it was time to invest in a pro account, so I could use the pro features in my game.... but thats been thrown out of the window now....
So yup... thanks GameSalad... your forcing me to make a decision, and one that I cant really spend too long waiting to decide on. So the delay in getting any solid information is just forcing my choice against you all the easier.
Just wanted to clarify something.. When my subscription ends, the apps I've built with Gamesalad will still be available on the appstore, I just won't be able to update them, right? Or will old non- "Gamesalad Direct" games be taken off the appstore?
talking apple TOS, I felt like writing a Steve Jobs email. Always gets a reply from someone in apple, usually a helpful one. I'm sure someone will probably delete this post quickly, but here it is for now.
************
Hi Steve,
I am not sure if you are aware of the rather sad situation with gamesalad.com currently. They are changing from being a paid development tool for iOS devices to being a sub store of the app store (we make games for them that they sell and then redistribute the cash to us). Unfortunately as they decided to not inform any customers about their plans they have now announced that all existing developers will be eventually forced to move their games to their own GameSalad itunes account or they will no longer allow them to be updated. I am not quite sure what standing they have with apple to be allowed to force developers away from itunesconnect and apple and into their own system and to blackmail developers into putting their apps in GameSalads itunes account on threat of not being allowed to update anymore.
Thanks for any help in clarifying whether this is ok with apple.
We knew that our announcement of GameSalad Direct would draw a strong reaction from our developer community. What we didn’t realize was that we had done such a poor job of addressing the issues most important to you.
What is it really that you "think" the community's issues are? Please poll and see if you're correct in your assumptions.
What exactly is GameSalad Direct? GameSalad Direct is GameSalad’s new publishing service that will provide independent GameSalad developers with a suite of game creation tools and publishing services for the App store. Taken together, GameSalad Direct represents a scalable and social way to expand the capabilities and reach of your games.
New Publishing service? - How are you envisioning competing with existing "Sucessful" publishers? Exactly what do you mean by Scalable? How are you suggesting a sociable way of expanding the reach of our games is going to work? Apple already has "Game Center" and Open Feint is already widely used in apps.
Why are we creating GameSalad Direct? GameSalad Direct helps us solve a number of problems faced by our community. First, once GameSalad Direct is in place, we will be able to easily connect players of one GameSalad game with other GameSalad games, increasing downloads across the community. Second, when a developer makes a break out game, we’ll be able to provide additional support, whether that support is marketing or otherwise, to help the game obtain even greater success. Finally, by moving to a revenue share model (details below), we are aligning our interests with that of the community – when you win, we win.
Why would a successful GS developer want to take focus off their brand by cross promoting other peoples games unless it's from already existing methods ie. iAds? I'm sure they would be more interested in both revenue from their own game coupled with iAds (if in fact they want ads anyway) and promoting only their other games and app's within App. All of this they can do anyway I believe in Pro. Also in any other framework.
How much will GameSalad Direct cost? As part of the move to GameSalad Direct, the full-featured “Pro” version of GameSalad Creator will be free to download and use. When a game is published via GameSalad Direct, both the developer and GameSalad will share in the revenue at rates favorable to the developer, especially for the most successful games. There are also some administrative fees related to publishing. The specific amounts and revenue shares will be posted once we release GameSalad Direct. They key benefit of this pricing model is that it allows more people to try their hand at making games because the tool is free, but also encourages quality.
Why say you're answering a question and then not?? Where are the actual figures?? You must have them already, hence the new business model change. So why not tell us already?
What happens to my existing subscription? If you have an existing subscription to GameSalad, that subscription is going to continue for the remaining life of the subscription. Nothing about GameSalad Direct will take away or restrict your access to GameSalad during your subscription term. You’ll still create and publish your games exactly as you’ve done so in the past. If your subscription has recently expired or is about to expire, contact customer support and we’ll work with you to make sure you have an extension until we launch GameSalad Direct.
And what of us who have only recently purchased subscriptions a month or so ago? Do we get our money back or some sort of credit now that we know that the T&C's of continuing subscriptions are completely reverse of what we signed up for in the first place? Or even the Pro version for the rest of the term of our subs? To be inline with the functionality of the now "Free" users. This latter I'm sure would please the current express users and P**S current Pro users off, but also by doing this you could have alot of current Express users willing to purchase a Pro version come the end of their subs because they may have been able to make the money to allow them the purchase. Obviously this would mean that you would have to retain a Pro version business model aswell as a direct. You may also find that the Casual express users may then be happy to go the Direct route in the belief that they could benefit from your "Publishing experience" and have you manage their growth up til the time that they themselves could purchase the Pro version.
Who owns a game published under GameSalad Direct? You do. All of your creative effort belongs to you, from game play and character names, through art to the look and feel of the user experience. You will own all of your intellectual property in the games you create with GameSalad. By using GameSalad Direct, you will be granting GameSalad the right to publish the game via the App Store. Even after publishing with GameSalad Direct, you will be able to update your game, change pricing or even remove it from the App Store.
Seems like this is actually not the case. If ownership is to be retained, then all control of marketing, Apple accounts, funds management and especially the Published APP STORE name would be freely available to the developer on their Apple Developer account. In your direct model description so far, this is not the case.
What about my identity as an independent developer? When you publish through GameSalad Direct, you will still be able to brand your game uniquely to you. We do not want to interfere with your reputation or growth as a developer. We recognize that many of our community members rely on GameSalad for their livelihood. You have our commitment that GameSalad will continue to be a viable tool for that purpose. In fact, GameSalad Direct provides us with the means to better support our most successful developers. For example, you will still be able to use promo codes and will have access to expanded analytics based on not only your game (what you currently get from the App Store), but the community as a whole. Also, we are introducing an App specifically for testing called the “GameSalad Player” that will be available through the App Store.
Identity of an independent developer is solely dependant of being that. Independent. Publishing from one's own Developer Account means that we retain that independence. Are you doing this Analytics by incorporating Flurry or any other similar free mobile apps Analytics services or have you developed your own analytics that will have no history that the others have?
What happens to my existing games? Your games stay on the App Store. You are free to continue to update your games for the rest of your existing subscription term. Once your subscription expires, you’ll be able to move your games over to GameSalad Direct.
Well of course existing games stay on the app store unless one feels like pulling them down because we have control of them at this juncture. Bulldozing people to move their games over to the Direct model if they are wanting to maintain and update their apps once their current subscription is a totally fascist move since you have them by the short and curlies.
While we are excited about the opportunity that GameSalad Direct brings to our community, nothing is yet set in stone. We’ll continue to listen to your feedback and concerns, and adjust the program features accordingly. Also, we’re working with Apple to make sure that all that we do as a company and a community is beneficial to the App Store and its customers.
Just a little sceptical here, but why would apple be making a deal with you guy's when they can't even deal with a company that has a fully fledged visual dev environment, and has had for years? "Adobe" How can what you're suggesting be seen as beneficial to the app store and it's customers?
I’m really excited about the changes we have planned and I hope that you’ll give us a chance to show you what we have to offer. I’m looking forward to working with all of you in making great games.
I thought that you were telling us what you had to offer in this supposed FAQ. But it's seems tis just smoke and mirrors to try and throw us off the scent again.
scitunes said: GS, we'll know you heard us when you bring back a pro option that lets us publish our own games to our own accounts without giving up a percentage.
There's really no need for yellow posts until you can give us an answer on that.
Bingo! This yellow post doesn't really address the concerns of the community.
Here's something I noticed...
If your subscription has recently expired or is about to expire, contact customer support and we’ll work with you to make sure you have an extension until we launch GameSalad Direct.
Maybe we could all upgrade to "Pro" now, enjoy one more year of fun with GameSalad, and then move on to other software development kits.
The icon said the most to me... it was gray... like the life was sucked out of GameSalad.
This will be the death of Gamesalad, it'll be forgotten in internet history if Direct goes this way. The best thing GS could do is continue their current strategy, improve the software's limitations and maybe give people the option of using Direct.
Comments
IS ANYONE IN THE SAME BOAT AS ME?????
OK, here is the deal. I know many of you use GS to make your own games. And because of this you are upset at the possibility of what the Direct program might mean, and I can understand why. But in my case I don't use GS to make games for myself, instead I use GS to make apps for other companies. If Direct takes away my ability create apps the other companies can then publish them selves, then there is just now way I can continue using GS!
It's not like I am just being grumpy about some kind of new revenue sharing deal these guys are cooking up and I just want to boycott GS and Direct. If I can't use GS to create apps that companies can publish under their own terms then the guys here at GS leave me with nothing!
GUY AT GAMESALAD, if I can't continue using your tools to make apps for other companies, then where the heck are you leaving me????
Is anyone else like me out their, and uses GameSalad to make apps for other companies??
"OK you can still use Photoshop to work as a graphic designer, but from now on you have to pass every image you make through us. And one more thing, we want to publish all your design work through us"
If that happened, I would have to drop Photoshop as a tool right away. You could be the best tool in the world! But if you don't give us designers a pro option, how can we use it???
Couple that with the fact that I don't reckon users on subscriptions will get any updates past 0.8.9 either and this is all crap for us. (perhaps we'll get the next beta as its been in development a while, but that'll be it).
Then again the two kinda add up together don't they, you won't even be able to add new features to older games anyway.
I feel your pain! I just read the new letter. Are you like me and make apps for other companies? I just can't believe that GameSalad would no longer allow me to develop Apps for other companies with out forcing me to publish through them. There is now way I could use GS professionally if there isn't a pro option,
For months and even years GameSalad will have to work to reverse all the negative reviews, tweets and feelings towards Gendai that pop up each day... it will not be an easy task, especially if they plan on waiting another week.
I use Photoshop as professional graphic designer because it's the best tool for the job.
I use Pro Tools as a musician because it's the best tool for the job.
I use Maya as a 3D artist because it's the best tool for the job.
But if any of the companies that make those tools forced me to publish my professional work through them, then I would be forced to use other tools that let me be a free professional!
GameSalad, don't be stupid! killing a pro option that enables people to do the work that I do for other companies, kills any hope of your tool being considered a professional design tool.
Will talk now..
You should think twice before doing something. There are a lot of users who are NOT in US. And NOT publishing games for US or NOT even in English.
So "We'll be able to provide additional support, whether that support is marketing or otherwise, to help the game obtain even greater success." part becomes a lie... How will you market the app in different countries when you don't even know which language is talked there?
Situation is: Even I'm on top of few categories in my countries AppStore, I still get a LITTLE amount of sales per day. Some of my #1 apps in categories like Lifestyle makes only 100-150$ in a month. But I still want to stay in my countries AppStore. With making 7-8 apps like that, I'm earning more, but, with QUANTITY (With making more apps, and earning a little wtih every single one). That is how it SHOULD be in here. The reason is, the credit-card users in iTunes in my country are really a minority. Even if you sell your app to all of the users (Which is impossible) you would still not earn that much. That is why, I should publish more and more apps to get every one individually get sold in similarly few units as my other apps. So if I would pay that damn "Per-Publish Fee" for every app, my business becomes non-logical and non-profitable. I'm okay with revenue share (By saying I'm okay, I mean that's better than coding, I hate it but I accept it.) but if "Publishing Fee" happens, I'm out. And I will take as much as I can froum you as I leave. Because if you hit us, WE hit you back.
So with users like TshirtBooth or FireMapleGames this fee may not be a problem, may not seem like a lot, but, who can guarantee anyone can make "Per-Publish Fee" and continue to earn and start profiting? (As long as Fee is not 5$. )
You always seem you care about the community, and seem like you are always sensitive about us etc. etc. But now if anyone asks, I would say, you are just trying to earn more money, which is normally a good thing, but with messing up the current paid users, not cool....
You are like any of us. You made an app, you placed it in the AppStore, sold it, and now getting really bad reviews and feedback. What would any of us do? We would give up the new idea or CHANGE it according to the paid users.
And I think what you are doing is something like this: Consider I'm a super-duper talented graphic artist. And I can make this look like this. But I suck at making games. So I make a crappy game but make incredible graphics and screenshots. So game gets noticed and gets sold. But almost NONE of the users likes the game. Some of them hates it. But the game still continues to sell just for good screenshots. Just because costumers think it is a good game. Is it ethical for me to keep selling it?
I'm not even commenting on the 'you can't update your old games without giving them to us' part.
I think that is all for now.. Sorry for the English..
Amen brother! ^_^
Will we be able to send preview builds to gamers sites with this?
Will we be able to enter contests with this?
I have some doubts.
Such as:
- Whether old subscription members will be allowed to use new versions of GS **This is a biggie**
- The excellent point about languages above (are gendai pretty good at chinese or arabic submission?)
- The fact pros are now completely cut out (no you can't create apps for other companies now)
- Whether they are reviewing apps based on quality before submission to apple
- How they deal with tax
- How they can be trusted to handle monthly payments
- How does it work with contracts to apple for sales (kinda obvious really, they sign em and we are their family friendly forum)
- The fact that apple don't allow withdrawn apps to be rereleased by new companies with the same game name (as they suggest to do after your subscription expires).
- Whether apple are happy that someone operates a sub-store within their store
to mention a few
Because, as far as I can see, what just happened was a yellow post (and an email) repeating the EXACT same thing that was said previously in a shorter post.
You said you wanted to address the biggest concerns, so address them. Don't repeat the same damn thing that has everyone so angry, so sad and so worried.
We want to know one thing, I believe, above all else;
Is there any chance we will have an option besides using you as our "publisher"?
Also, how exactly will you be handling the GST on your end for Australians and (I think, I'm not really that knowledgeable about Canada) Canada?
This feels like it's really going to complicate tax time; and in Australia when using an ABN and charging GST, it's complex enough already.
You raise some very interesting points.
I'm especially curious about Gendai's response to one in particular, and have some questions for their COO, Mr. Coppersmith:
Since you have customers worldwide, will GameSalad Direct enable us to publish to any iTunes app store of our choice?
Can we publish to several countries at the same time?
Will there be a per-country publishing fee?
Will you have the means to receive payment from Apple in the currency of those countries, so there is no conversion fee to US funds, then another conversion back to local funds when you pay us our remaining percentage?
Even if you don't currently have a corporate presence in all the countries where there are App Stores so that you can publish games, then receive and distribute funds to customers in those countries, do you plan to do so? If so, do you have a timeline you can share with us? If not, what are your plans?
Perhaps I'm naive about dealing with multiple app stores in multiple countries with multiple currencies, and this is all quite simple.
Thank you in advance for your answers.
Steve
Ive yet to see a corporate business that pays its users immediately. So Gendai/GameSalad will have to wait as usual for payments from Apple, and then they'll have their own additional schedule for paying out moneys owed to developers, that no doubt, will have an inbuilt period long enough to generate some additional interest on the funds in their account before they release them.
So payment periods will probably double....
I've enjoyed working with GS. I'd like to keep working with GS, but if Direct is the only option, that will not happen. At this point, I'm not sure the boss would be interested now even if they did keep some sort of Pro (independent) option.
Disappointed. Thanks for taking the time out to write something, though the questions still remain.
For me, Ive got a project that Ive been working on since March... mostly in my spare time between contracts, but its still a couple of months worth of work. Im about 80% complete. By the time its finished, I'll only have 3 months left on my Express account, and so wont have long to do updates before the license expires and Im forced to take up Direct or leave.
One of my regular clients is interested in the game, and has suggested I stop work on the GS version, and let them rewrite it in code, where they can add Plus+ and Gamecentre, and cross promote it from their other popular products. I really wanted to finish the game and release it under my own name, but the new GS direction is forcing my hand and making me question if theres really any point in even finishing my current products with their software, let alone any future ones. If Im going to be forced into a co-publishing deal, then I'd prefer to at least be able to choose who my partner is going to be.
I was waiting for the next update of GameSalad to help decide if it was time to invest in a pro account, so I could use the pro features in my game.... but thats been thrown out of the window now....
So yup... thanks GameSalad... your forcing me to make a decision, and one that I cant really spend too long waiting to decide on. So the delay in getting any solid information is just forcing my choice against you all the easier.
Thanks
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Hi Steve,
I am not sure if you are aware of the rather sad situation with gamesalad.com currently. They are changing from being a paid development tool for iOS devices to being a sub store of the app store (we make games for them that they sell and then redistribute the cash to us). Unfortunately as they decided to not inform any customers about their plans they have now announced that all existing developers will be eventually forced to move their games to their own GameSalad itunes account or they will no longer allow them to be updated. I am not quite sure what standing they have with apple to be allowed to force developers away from itunesconnect and apple and into their own system and to blackmail developers into putting their apps in GameSalads itunes account on threat of not being allowed to update anymore.
Thanks for any help in clarifying whether this is ok with apple.
Well done. Keep us updated:)
i would very like to know apple's respond to this one..
Roy.
Exactly what do you mean by Scalable?
How are you suggesting a sociable way of expanding the reach of our games is going to work?
Apple already has "Game Center" and Open Feint is already widely used in apps. Why would a successful GS developer want to take focus off their brand by cross promoting other peoples games unless it's from already existing methods ie. iAds?
I'm sure they would be more interested in both revenue from their own game coupled with iAds (if in fact they want ads anyway) and promoting only their other games and app's within App.
All of this they can do anyway I believe in Pro. Also in any other framework. Why say you're answering a question and then not??
Where are the actual figures?? You must have them already, hence the new business model change. So why not tell us already? And what of us who have only recently purchased subscriptions a month or so ago? Do we get our money back or some sort of credit now that we know that the T&C's of continuing subscriptions are completely reverse of what we signed up for in the first place?
Or even the Pro version for the rest of the term of our subs? To be inline with the functionality of the now "Free" users.
This latter I'm sure would please the current express users and P**S current Pro users off, but also by doing this you could have alot of current Express users willing to purchase a Pro version come the end of their subs because they may have been able to make the money to allow them the purchase. Obviously this would mean that you would have to retain a Pro version business model aswell as a direct.
You may also find that the Casual express users may then be happy to go the Direct route in the belief that they could benefit from your "Publishing experience" and have you manage their growth up til the time that they themselves could purchase the Pro version. Seems like this is actually not the case. If ownership is to be retained, then all control of marketing, Apple accounts, funds management and especially the Published APP STORE name would be freely available to the developer on their Apple Developer account. In your direct model description so far, this is not the case. Identity of an independent developer is solely dependant of being that. Independent. Publishing from one's own Developer Account means that we retain that independence.
Are you doing this Analytics by incorporating Flurry or any other similar free mobile apps Analytics services or have you developed your own analytics that will have no history that the others have? Well of course existing games stay on the app store unless one feels like pulling them down because we have control of them at this juncture.
Bulldozing people to move their games over to the Direct model if they are wanting to maintain and update their apps once their current subscription is a totally fascist move since you have them by the short and curlies. Just a little sceptical here, but why would apple be making a deal with you guy's when they can't even deal with a company that has a fully fledged visual dev environment, and has had for years? "Adobe"
How can what you're suggesting be seen as beneficial to the app store and it's customers? I thought that you were telling us what you had to offer in this supposed FAQ. But it's seems tis just smoke and mirrors to try and throw us off the scent again.
Regards,
Alcamie
There's really no need for yellow posts until you can give us an answer on that.
Thanks.
Here's something I noticed... Maybe we could all upgrade to "Pro" now, enjoy one more year of fun with GameSalad, and then move on to other software development kits.
The icon said the most to me... it was gray... like the life was sucked out of GameSalad.
EDIT:
Grayscale Tag added